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Discussion Starter #1
does the winter take away fuel mileage! I've noticed that now that its getting into the 30s over night that im using more fuel! on the way too work both ways!
 

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Livin in the flatlands.
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You will lose economy burning #1 fuel, but that shouldn't be out yet.
But cold air is more dense, so more air goes into your engine, requiring more fuel.
Also, guessing you may be idling more for warm up?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
local fill up station is out with the winterized fuel! only idling for a few minutes, then off i go! should i let it warm up for a longer period of time! im plugging it in so i figured it didnt need much time too warm up!!? and i just put in new ZD-11's!
 

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It ain't the fuel boys. Its the air density.

Aero drag is proportional to air density. Cold, dry air is denser than warm, moist air.

Unless you live in Alaska, you wouldn't be getting winter blend just yet.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
sorry to argue! put fuel in today at kwik trip, big red sign says winter blend on the pump plan as day!! and a red tag on the coupler! I'm in WI! frosty in the mornings!
 

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OBS junkie
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You'll loose MPG with your hubs locked in, usually around town & on country roads I leave em locked. Right before I hit the highway I unlock em then relock on the exit ramp depending on conditions.
 

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Science rulz
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The hubs hurt a fair bit, and I guess the air density hurts a fair bit too.

I've been having to use the 4wd a bit the last week since they haven't been plowing the roads... And it really killed my mileage.
 

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Science rulz
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where do you live??? you have snow already?
*Points to top right corner of post*

Ålesund - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Anyway, it probably won't last much into next week.. I think, looks like it's melting a bit already. We usually don't get much snow until December, and usually it doesn't get real cold or snowy until January, but we'll see how this year turns out. Got a decent 8 or so inches.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
i did thanks!
 

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??? Dave said it would ONLY be out in Alaska at this point. He is not in Alaska and they have Winter blend out. That means what he stated was not quite accurate and Hendrickbus was correcting his assumption on the release date of winterized fuel. I do not think his was disputing him on colder air is denser and therefore takes more energy to move thru.

I can accept the fact about that colder air and changes to air density and its effects on drag. But if that was the only or the major cause you would not see such a dramatic change upon the initial change over to #1 from #2. Many times there are warm up after #1 has been released but mpg does not seem to get much better. Not until #2 is back at the pumps does mpg seem to go back up. I think its well proven that the fuel changes made to winterized fuel in both diesel and gasoline engines hurts mpg.

More support for this based on posted made by Volkswagen/Mercedes W210 owners. Their 1999 owners manuals state that during very cold weather they may mix up to 10% kerosene into there diesel to prevent gelling etc but to expect a fuel mileage drop.


But really I think we need to look at the entire big picture at how our fuel efficiency is reduced by cold weather. It goes far beyond just one thing. Many of these people know but they forget about when looking at the issue.

* Fuel reformulation for colder temps: Fuels wintertime formulations result in less available energy for combustion.


* More Idling: This is even larger for our diesels. We tend to idle in the cold weather many times longer. Some may not but still it goes up. That is fuel burnt for zero return in vehicle movement.

* Vehicle Lubricants viscosity: No only engine oil but transmission, axles everything. It therefore take more energy to make all the parts more thru this.

* Road Conditions: The smoother it is the better the driving efficiency. Add salt pot holes from plowing, ice, snow, wet roads etc..

* Tire Pressure: Most use air and unless you are careful to be checking your tires the pressure is going down in the winter. Nitrogen can help with this.

* Rolling Resistance of the tires: Even if you're completely attentive to proper tire pressure, cold ambient temperatures will still cause your tires to return worse mileage. That's because a tire's shape isn't completely round - the sidewall bulges out at the bottom, and where the tread meets the road the small contact patch is actually flat. As the tire rotates, it constantly deforms to this shape, and this deformation requires more energy when the rubber is cold and hard. Rolling resistance at 0 degrees F is 20% greater than at 80 degrees

Lower average Engine Temp: In the winter, an engine takes longer to reach operating temperature and cools off faster when shut off. Your PCM has different settings based on temps that effect engine perf. You also have the issue of the fluids viscosity climbing in here as well upon cool downs. Maybe that 203 T-stat International uses makes better sense when you consdier winter times effects such as these.

* Increased electrical loads: Electrical power is not a free byproduct in vehicles. It takes energy. In colder temps, you use electrical accessories more often. Lights (in higher lattitudes it's darker in the winter), rear window defroster, heater blower motor, heated seats/mirrors, windshield washer pump for frequently cleaning off dirty road spray. Something I came across for the effects of electrical load on mpg http://mb-soft.com/public/headlite.html

* More aerodynamic drag. As has been pointed out colder air is denser air and also creates more friction and thus takes more energy to move thru.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
tarm, thanks for the post! hopefully I'll be laid off for the winter season and wont be driving the truck every day! it didnt think about the idling for 5 to 10 minutes would add up in loss mpg! sorry i blonde it their! so sorry again! good point about all the other fluids being cold and taken more energy to warm up! all a slip of mind! point in case I need a garage!! lol!! thanks again!!
 

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Don't idle the durn truck! That's gas engine thinking.

Gas engines idle against a throttle plate which provides virtual load and the gas engine warms up quickly. The diesel has no throttle, so is very efficient at idle. The trucks will idle all day and never really warm up.

I run with my EBPV electrically disconnected, so I know it takes about four miles of light load (suburban traffic) to warm up.

If you have oil pressure, put it in gear and drive away easy. That's your quickest warmup plan. With HEUI, if the engine is running, you have oil pressure.
 

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Don't idle the durn truck! That's gas engine thinking.

Gas engines idle against a throttle plate which provides virtual load and the gas engine warms up quickly. The diesel has no throttle, so is very efficient at idle. The trucks will idle all day and never really warm up.

I run with my EBPV electrically disconnected, so I know it takes about four miles of light load (suburban traffic) to warm up.

If you have oil pressure, put it in gear and drive away easy. That's your quickest warmup plan. With HEUI, if the engine is running, you have oil pressure.
I'm not sure if it is just me not knowing a lot about diesels or not understanding my truck but if I use high idle and the ebpv runs isn't that supposed to put a load on the engine to warm it up. I know you said you ran with your ebpv disconnected but mine still is and if it doesn't help with warm up what is its function other than to lower my mpg and pi$$ me off all winter?
 

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I'm not sure if it is just me not knowing a lot about diesels or not understanding my truck but if I use high idle and the ebpv runs isn't that supposed to put a load on the engine to warm it up. I know you said you ran with your ebpv disconnected but mine still is and if it doesn't help with warm up what is its function other than to lower my mpg and pi$$ me off all winter?
idling is just that, idling.

the Ebpv creates an exhaust restriction to hole pressure back in the engine to make it try and warm up. watch your egt gauge... when i had mine,(ebpv) i had it manually controlled, having the high idle 1200rpm. the egt's and time to actually get some warmth in the truck were the same. open or closed.

if you live in snow country, make a winter front. mine will be going in once it gets around teens to 20 constantly. have some pictures of it some where... crude but works well :doh: ill let mine sit and idle for a few min, when it gets real cold at 1200rpm. trying to get the ice off the windshield but you do have to drive it and load up the engine to make it warm up.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
i have those Lund grill inserts! I was woundering if blocking the air flow to the tranny cooler would raise the temp and take out the tranny! I dont have a gauge yet! or wont it bother!! thanks!!:fordoval:
 
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