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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a 2 ton Luxaire air handler. It is 11 y.o. and my heat pump compressor just died. I believe life expectancy is 15-20 and I am not sure if Luxaire is a good brand. What outside unit do you suggest to go with my Luxaire air handler? I am not sure what refrigerant it was using, I think r-22. Thanks.
 

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Not sure on the split unit's but my last Carrier unit lasted 25 yrs and it was still running when I replaced it ,, the whole time I had it it only needed a few contactors

I now have a new Carrier lol
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Yeah, I was thinking carrier and Lennox. But, I am not sure how mismatched brands are. I am sure some will try to talk me into buying both pieces, but I really only want to buy the outside unit.
 

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Edward Scissorhand WanaB
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Trane
 

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you might as well get both together. Most likely you will have to due to the freon change. Newer will be more eficient. Most likely also 2 ton is too small for most homes. May want to see about upgrade to a 3 ton. Looke for the tax credit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
It is only an 1100 sqft condo. I am suprised that the original lennox lasted 12 years, and the luxaire lasted 11. What the heck? How long should it last?
 

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It is only an 1100 sqft condo. I am suprised that the original lennox lasted 12 years, and the luxaire lasted 11. What the heck? How long should it last?
they say that is a normal life span for home appliances. Feel lucky anything over 12. My a/c going on 16 years. Knock on wood. I pray every year that it is still going. Had to have a a/c repair for a fan motor this past summer. A/c repair man said he was supprised that the system has lasted that long. If the compressor fails or something major, I'm looking at total replacement $4-5K. New freon requirements. Our sub division is starter homes living space about the same as yours. Ranch houses 3 bedroom average. 1/2 the houses had to replace units and get bigger up grade to 2.5-3 ton. All told the builder grade 2 ton units were not enough. Newer a/c more efficient.
 

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Power Junky
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lennox is a texas company. i wouldnt put their crap in my house. they are junk. we sell primarily carrier we also sell lennox and trane. and for the most part carrier is pretty good. trane seems to have alot of really cool technology but they are expensive compared to carrier. where i live i wouldnt expect a system to las much over 10yrs it dosent really matter the brand either.. they just dont build them like they did 10-15yrs ago. now days they are chasing a efficency level (that means that having heavy duty and lasting parts will likely reduce efficency) in texas this summer we stayed above 80 and normally in the tripple digits for 3 months strait with no rain at all. a/c systems work their butts off. people run them year round here since it never gets really cold here. there are alot of big names like trance, rheem, carrier, lennox and goodman. in reality carrier has lot of companys tied to them such as payne, bryant, adp and bdp. then there are the companies help by the same people that own carrier which equated to their products being eeriely similar the are brands like heil comfortmaker, arco aire, comfort master etc. trane has american standart. i can remember the ones for lennox . goodman has amana and janitrol. rheem has ruud and weather king. i would look at warranty 1st and credibility of the installer. odds are good reguardless of the brand purchased you will get a copeland compressor. emerson or ge will be the company that builds the condensor fan motor. mars will likely manufacture the contactor etc.... basically what im trying to say is that all the companies use the same parts bins for 90% of the parts. about the only big differences between most of them is the computer control boards.
 

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Power Junky
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if you currently have a 2 ton system with a 2ton indoor coil you do not want to get a larger condensor. you will have issues and a good a/c guy should steer you clear of that. now if you were to replace the entire system you could go up in tonnage. installing a larger condensor on a smaller evap coil will basically reduce efficency and provide more capacity then the coil can handle. it will generally shorten the life of the compressor because there will be liquid flood back
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I was told that carrier is very expensive with replacement parts, more so than the other brands. Any truth to that.
 

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In my 34 years in the HVAC trade, I have found that 80% of all compressor failures are from poor installation practices. I Have worked for companies that sell Trane, Lennox and Carrier products. IMHO if you stay with the big three you will do good. Lubbockguy has some very valid points about manufactuing practices today. I would be more concerned about the installation than anything. Clean, professional installers that use proper practices. I have seen many guys that braze refrigeration lines without purging with nitrogen, use soft silver solder, mount lines to where vibration and noise transfer into home and do messy wiring. get bids and references. LOTS OF REFERENCES. if they won't give you refernces from their customers,,Walkaway!!!!!! Look closely at each individual warranty. Do not be afraid to ask a lot of questions, this is an important purchase, Best of luck to you.
 

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I have a Trane system with electronic air cleaner and really like it. I would also get the highest seer rating you can afford.
I also have my systems serviced twice per year. It sounds like overkill but they have found some problems early and it was all covered under the service agreement.
 

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Power Junky
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Any factory part is going to be pricey. The new carrier fan coils or air handlers have gone boardless which means the fan motor incorporates a ac/dc invertor and acts as the brain replacing a circuit board for operation. These units are to new to know what we would charge for them out side of warranty but the ecms that are in 06 units just our of warranty are costing customers $650-1550. There are several occasions where it would be literally a couple hundred bucks different to buy a whole unit. Keep in mind these are factory parts. They are getting to the point that it will be no cheaper to fix them then replace them. Also they are closing the window on the aftermarket since so much is in the motor it is going to be hard to get a will fit motor. I went to a trane training class 2weeks ago and they will be putting on board diagnostics with a digital readout on their new units along with a whole lot of stuff added. I don't even want to know what that stuff is going to cost. It is going to be a nightmare. It is a trend that everything is headed to as efficiency increases you will see a shorter life and by the time it is 5yr old it is old tech. Hence the reason I recommend getting the longest warranty which with most companies is 10yrs parts and labor. All of them are doing this. Iirc goodman is cheaper on some parts but by far lennox and trane seem to be higher priced. Carrier is next and then icp products. Weather king and ruud/ rheem are at time reasonable as well.
 

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Power Junky
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As far as seer efficency I would get a 14-16 seer unless the rebates are really good and will pay a large portion of the difference in price. The new trane units can have a very high seer rating but I am just leary of their new super duper unit with a varible electronic txv. Seems likke if you have a issue you will have a hard time finding a tech that will be wiling to find the problem vs throwing parts at it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Lubbockguy1979,
I am still trying to absorb the price of this thing. It annoys me that I may have to do this every 10 years or so. What about finding an independent guy to hook in this for me:
GSH130241A | Goodman GSH130241A 2 Ton Heat Pump

I am getting estimates of about $3300 for a new condensing unit installed. It appears that I could purchase the part on line for about $1300 to my door. I know it would need to be installed and charged, but why is it so expensive? It seems like Goodman is a know brand.
 

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IMHO,, please do not buy one off the internet,,dealing with warranty is next to impossible. Please buy one from a local dealer, which ever brand you decide on. I have dealt with many Goodman units that people buy off the web. A real PITA!!!! Goodmans are my least favorite..remember the age old saying------------you get what you pay for.
 

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i have been in the buisness for 10 years and i have narrowed down to goodman due to the 10 year parts warranty and reasonable cost. most all components are the same regardless of whos name is on the box. the new unit will use r-410a instead of r-22 so the evaporatir coil will need replaced too, since that and a fan are all that are in the airhandler i would replace it too. the matched system will have the same warranty, you can spend 3k or 5k and youll be replacing it in 10 or 15 years either way. thats my .02
 

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Here is the deal. You will be contracting the job. You will be responsible for the unit. You are 100% liable for it. Its you dealing with warranty if there is a issue. They normally (goodman for example) can track the sale and know where it was sold. The fine print to any warranty is that it must be sold and installed by a lic hvac contractor. If it was not sold and installed they may not cover the warranty. The reason you are not paying 1300 for the unit though is business. The company you are buying the system and labor has to make a profit (now days that is criminal, everyone should work for free and pay their employees 100k a year) included in this labor and unit cost comes experience and knowledge. They company has to maintain insurance on the company, vehicles etc. Pay of for lic and epa fees. Pay the employee, pay for fuel as well as pay the remaining overhead. Most states make it illegal to work or install hvac equipment unless the provider has a contractor lic. This means they follow the epa regulations of handling refrigerants, gas etc. They will have to recover the bad refrigerant in your current system, they will also have to pay to dispose of that freon. That is not cheap. there are costs involved that they have that your not taking into account.
 

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It is possible to use a miss matched unit yes but it will not have the rated efficency that it would have had. It could be better efficency or worst. The comapnies don't evaluate mis matched equipment though.
Yes a fact of the times hvac equipment will not last for ever. It may be 5 or 10yrs old. But what you do not see is the equipment likely runs 10-30mins a hour every hour 365days a year. It causes wear and tear starting and stopping. The units now days are not lasting like the older ones, the new ones are of a higher precision which means that they wear out fater. The companies are building to meet efficency levels not longivity.

As for goodman. They have come along way in the past 5yrs. They are a lot better than they were. They also offer good warranties. But trane and carrier as well as icp all offer good warranties. The only thing goodman has over them is they offer unit replacement. If the comp fails they will replace the entire condensor. Carrier, trane and icp just replace the compressor. That being said in my house I'd likely go with icp or carrier. Goodman would be next and trane would be last. I would not under any circumstances buy or have a lennox. But that is my opinion, some people hate everything else and love lennox and/or other brands. Similar to the dodge, chevy and ford like and dislikes...
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Lubbockguy1979,
I understand the licensing cost and overhead. It just must be much higher than I thought. It sounds like I will end up paying $2k more than what I can get the condensor off the internet, to have it installed. That seems like a very large mark up on something that, I have been led to believe, will take a few hours to install.

But, anyway, it seems like I should either replace just the compressor or buy the whole new system. The HVAC forum guys really don't like the idea of going with the 13 seer condensing unit and the 10 seer air handler.

I got a price of about $1800 to do the compressor and $3000-$3500 to do the condensing unit.
Thanks for everyone's advice. I have the 2nd company coming to the house on Friday and I have a 2 more recommended companies to call. I will see what they say and bounce it off of you guys. Thanks.
 
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