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matt
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Discussion Starter #1
lookin for some input about preturbo injection. im thinking about adding a nozzle before my turbo. i realize that it can damage the blades if water droplets that are too large hit it, but im not worried about that. just wondering if any of you guys have tried it before? will it change the turbo map too much sence we have custom tunning? would it perform that much better?
 

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I Love Work'N On Hot Rods
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I would say that since the charge of air wouldnt be as dense as say just before the intake manifold, I think you WILL most definitely cause damage to the turbo. (I know your not "worried" about that but you should be very much so.) It would be like trying to inject the water/meth at idle. You basically dont have enough air to vaporize the water/meth and will end up with it basically being sprayed (not the right kind of spray if you know what I mean) at your turbo. Even on a HOT (i.e. 90*F+) summer day, I would still say it is a bad idea. There is a reason that water/meth controllers only inject it when the truck is at a certain boost level and that is because there is enough air at a high enough temperature to transfer enough heat so you dont end up with liquid water in the engine (i.e. relatively incompressible). Even if it works, I am not sure what you will accomplish but it definitely wont be higher power. JMO man. Hate to see you waste a good turbo.
 

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matt
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Discussion Starter #3
right i understand what your trying to say,but the meth will chemicaly alter the compressor map to simulate a larger turbo, and with a small nozzle like a 1gph the droplets would be atomized enough not to harm the blades.
 

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matt
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Discussion Starter #4
im asking would we see a positive effect from the larger compressor map? more air flow is better most of the time.
 

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I Love Work'N On Hot Rods
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Ok, I got ya. Well it seems to me like it would be driving in the rain to a certain degree or let's look at it this way, the only you are going to do if it works is lower the IAT a little more and I can tell you I really dont believe it will open your compressor map enough to make a difference or worth the hassle. I say that because, when I drive my truck in cooler weather (i.e. say 40-50*F OAT), the IAT is lower at this temp than say at 80*F and I dont see better mileage. All of my other temps, ECT, EOT, TFT, etc are all the same but I still get the same amount of horse power. Not sure if this helps but hope it does.
 

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matt
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911 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
this is from devilsown injection:
We don't recommend this location at all if you do not have the proper equipment such as the proper nozzle, nozzle size and high pressure pump. Locating the nozzle here is the most controversial location. The majority of alcohol/water injection users do not use this location. One reason for someone to inject at this location is the water/methanol mixture chemically alters the turbo compressor map. The water/methanol injection will dynamically shifts the compressor map of the turbo so that it has the compressor map exhibits the characteristics of a larger turbo. This sounds great but, the main issue with pre-turbo nozzle placement is what mixture can damage the compressor blade if the mixture is not properly atomized when passing through the turbo.

In order to inject pre-turbo with out compressor damage you need a high quality low volume nozzle and high enough pressure to get the water as finely misted as possible, and the smaller nozzle which allows for smaller/finer water droplets. We recommend you mount the nozzle as close to the compresser as possible.
 

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I Love Work'N On Hot Rods
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Hmmm :idk:
 

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matt
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Discussion Starter #8
Anyone running meth have anything to say??
 

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been running water injection for quite a while on mine. Absolutly no reason to put a nozzle before the turbo....just plain stupid IMO. Put the nozzles right in the intake elbow where they're suppose to be. You will not gain anything by putting it before the turbo.
 

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i have two nozzles in my elbow. The boost referrence for the boost controller is between the two nozzles.
 

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matt
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Discussion Starter #11
what size nozzles are you using? i think i could go larger
 

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matt
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Discussion Starter #13
were spraying about the same amount have you ever sprayed more than a 50/50 mix?
 

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i only use windshield washer fluid. the cheap blue winter stuff at walmart. It works awesome and a very noticeable hp kick when it comes on.
 

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matt
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Discussion Starter #15
thanks for your input
 

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i only use windshield washer fluid. the cheap blue winter stuff at walmart. It works awesome and a very noticeable hp kick when it comes on.
What kit are you using? When do you have it set to come on? Are you using it for towing?
 

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i have snow performance's stage II kit. I have it coming on at about 15psi. With the stage II kit...you really don't want it coming on much sooner than that or you'll quench the cylinders with too much of it. The stage III is better and more user adjustable cause you can controll each nozzle and when for it to come on...alot better for towing and all around. I had mainly got it when i was drag racing and truck pulling. I don't do much of that anymore cause i just dont have the time. But i still use it on the street once in a while. I don't tow with the truck.
 

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years ago ran a 50 shot of nitrous through a single fogger nozzle mounted right in the carb. of a draw through system installed on a bike. System went directly from single carb mounted on turbo inlet into a log style manifold before entering intake tracts. Had no problems with turbo from this setup. To the contrary it actually extended turbo life due to the nos cooling abilities. Where we had issues was in the manifold after the turbo as the fuel would fall out of suspension and puddle in the far ends. Turbo was an ole school rayjay plain bearing unit with cast wheels.
Not familiar with the volume of meth injection youd use with a setup like this but if its a reasonable amount and your atomization is good id think a modern turbo could handle it and im sure the low flash point of the meth, even though mixed with water would offer some cooling effect.
 

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injecting nitrous before the turbo is totally different than injecting a liquid before the turbo. Last thing i wanna do is have the water tear apart my compressor wheel.
 

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injecting nitrous before the turbo is totally different than injecting a liquid before the turbo. Last thing i wanna do is have the water tear apart my compressor wheel.
im not talkin bout just a dry shot of nitrous. im talking a wet shot through a fogger nozzle with enough gasoline to support an additional 50 hp. Now not being familiar with just how much water/meth youd be running through the turbo i cant for sure say if it would damage turbo but a 50hp shot of nitrous with enough c16 to support it is although not all that much there is liquid being introduced into the turbo albeit a finely atomized liquid!!!
I would think that how well you are able to atomize whatever you use is will determine how safe it will be but in all fairness im not privy to the volume needed.
If the accepted way to go is post turbo then all things being equal id go that route. BUT we ran gasoline and i know many that ran straight methanol/nos through turbo with no ill effects. Srtaight methanol will usually run at about twice the volume of race gas if your making all your power with it so id think that the guys running nos and meth were moving a decent amount of fluid through.
 
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