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Discussion Starter #1
First off I want to say I didn't buy this turbo from BWD as BBunting wasn't a TN dealer at the time. I've been more than happy with BWD, ITP, DI and several others I've done business with. I don't want to start any arguments between vendors, I just want to have a truck that works correctly. Here is the story. I think that I'm discovering that the TN drop in turbos (or the same turbo under one of it's numerous other names) might not be all they are cracked up to be. Following is my sob story on the toy hauling truck:

With just an Juice/Attitude, new stock AD's w/nozzles, and a couple other doo-dads I put down around 350/650. Couple weeks after the injector install (dyno'd before and after injectors [load dyno] and the ~650ft/lbs was after injectors) I installed the TN drop-in. Never dyno'd it. It was a bit laggy on the bottom but I don't much care about fast spool-up. It seemed once it was making boost to be pretty capable. What I now think I was feeling was just the additional lag making it feel like it was pushing more air later.

So I dumped the Edge for an F5, installed a Terminator, new fuel pump and I go back to the same dyno I got the above numbers on. HP was lower, but not excessively (which doesn't mean much as HP is more a function of speed than anything), however I lost about 100 ft/lbs of TQ. I was not happy.

Checked ICP, ect. No problems with the new pumps, they work great. Checked for boost leaks, up-pipe leaks and exhaust manifold leaks, all non existent yet it's all the turbo will do to make 22-23 psi of boost. I still get a noticeable amount of over-fueling with a load on it, telling me the turbo isn't providing enough CFM regardless of pressure. I think one problem maybe the turbine speed is too low. Changing turbine nozzle sizes (I'm assuming I'd have to change the turbine housing as turbos this small don't usually have separate turbine housing nozzles) would help, but I've talked with some guys running the 0.84A/R housing that weren't impressed with the improvement. Not sure what else to do but pull it off and put something different on it.

I know if it wasn't for bad luck I wouldn't have any :lame:
 

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Same dyno?

I hate to say it but I think your initial 350hp dyno number was false.

I have NEVER seen or heard of anyone making more than 300ish with Edge J/A.

Not saying it hasn't happened, nor am I questioning you. Just wondering if that first dyno run wasn't somehow very skewed.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
The first dyno run was done three times on the same day, but at different times. Even with the difference in humidity and temperature the three runs were not significantly different (less than 4% variation).

Also remember that the 350 runs with the J/A were with modd'd nozzles on brand new injectors. Even if the numbers were high (and they might be) the fact that the dyno consistently reads high is all that matters. Even if the 350 was high the fact that I lost so much TQ is significant so long as the dyno consistently reads high.
 

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Not sure what the issue is, but there seems to be something else wrong

Here is our old stanby with a weak HPOP, no fuel system, 80 econo tune-notice the boost is higher at lower RPM (as it can fuel):

1.00 drop in
 

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<<< THE GAUGE WHORE...
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Same thing I told you at the other site... I have swapped turbos so many times on this truck... The TN drop in is the best option out there for a stand up turbo, there is another issue there...

Again, I think you should try the .84 housing too... Drive pressures with the .84 housing are still lower then the Garrett 38r with the 1.00... and it spools faster...
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Brian, what do you think could be causing the problem? Before I put the turbo on I checked endplay and radial run out and they were next to non-existent so I don't think it's a cartridge problem and the compressor and turbine wheels looked good. I don't have any boost or exhaust leaks.

The test data you linked to is similar in setup to this truck, but you have more fuel. However, I don't think it's a lack of fuel that is causing the issue because I get a noticeable amount of over-fueling at WOT with a load on it.
 

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Did you get the F5 directly from Jody?????
My suggestion is talk to Jody about tuning.Im going through somewhat the same problem but mine is the low end(lag).Jody is changing the fuel on my chip so we will see how it works out.Top end mine is pulling hard and not as much smoke as I thought with the B-codes.
BTW I talked to Kevin @BWD last week and very he was very helpfull.Had me do a drive pressure test to make sure the TN was working properly and all came back OK.YOu may want to check dive pressure,may or may not rule out the turbo.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Yes, I got the F5 directly from Jody and he knew what turbo I was running and said he was familar with it and wrote the programming for it. Mine is laggy, but I don't care about that I don't race it.

Drive pressure was about 30psi at WOT.
 

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Couple thoughts

1) drive pressure is low, so either you have no fuel really, or there is a pressure leak
2) boost pressure is low, due to low drive pressure-so either the turbo is broke, tuning is no good, or the injectors aren't helping

3) is the wastegate working? Could it be bleeding off boost?
 

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Same thing I told you at the other site... I have swapped turbos so many times on this truck... The TN drop in is the best option out there for a stand up turbo, there is another issue there...

Again, I think you should try the .84 housing too... Drive pressures with the .84 housing are still lower then the Garrett 38r with the 1.00... and it spools faster...
I tryed the .84 and the 1.0 csipsd . the .84 spool up is better but mid and top it's like trying to suck air out of a 1/4 in hose. MY tn:lame: never spooled up any where near my gtp38 does. :swordfight:
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I've done everything but weld the wastegate shut. Currently I have it wired closed, unplugged and the rod adjusted just about as tight as I can get it.

I have checked for boost leaks, it'll hold 45 psi for around 12 minuets before loosing any pressure. It’ll hold 20psi for over an hour.

Next I pulled the exhaust loose at the down pipe and plugged off the DP under the truck and introduced smoke from the exhaust side and looked for leaks - nothing. I also replaced the up-pipes and all the associated hardware thinking I had an exhaust leak. The exhaust manifolds are also not leaking and have been milled flat.

Drive pressure was via EBV sensor, so take that into account when considerign the numbers. What should the drive pressure be at 23psi?

The injectors have about 9,000 miles on them and they were 100% new parts including the mod'd nozzles. They made ~350hp with the stock turbo and oil about 3500 miles ago.

I can't find anything that is obviously wrong with this thing. I've checked it all over well, including some items that wouldn't be suspect right away and it all looks good.
 

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69-it sounds like there might be a turbo issue, but instead of you trying to diagnose it, we'll eliminate that as an issue by sending you a new unit. Would that help? For future TN purchases, it would be good to go through BWD as they know the product better than anyone else.

Brian from TN
 

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Again... This is why I say got thru Turbonetics or BWD for your turbo needs... Nice...
 

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Discussion Starter #17
If BWD was a dealer when I bought it I certainly would have. I've bought quite a bit of stuff from BWD and am happy dealing with them.

FullBoost, thanks for the offer, it's appreciated.
 

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O W N E D

LOL Joe. You should check with Shay to see where she gets her BTS cheerleeding outfits and pom-poms from. You could get a couple TN sets made and get a group discount.......

Just messin with ya man.:hehe:
 
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