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Discussion Starter #1
97 F350 7.3 Turbo XLT Dually Stock
In December of 2018 I had an original injector go out. It is stock and has 380,000 miles on it. I had enough power with 1 cylinder missing to fairly easily pull my trailer home with no vibration...
I had all 8 injectors replaced with rebuilt ones. (plus glow plugs, under valve cover gaskets, GPR, and had the oil cooler rebuilt because of a leak.)
The truck ran fine until the TRS transmission range sensor went bad – replaced it and truck ran fine until a few months ago. The CEL would randomly come on – until I shut it off – and restarted – and CEL stayed off for several runs – then came back on – and repeat above.
Then one day I drove 100 miles – shut it off for 30 minutes – and it would not start – (tach needle moved) It was almost 2 quarts low on oil and a little low on antifreeze. Checked both - - and no coolant in oil – and no oil in coolant… (added oil & antifreeze)
After letting it sit for an hour – it fired right up. On the way home the CEL came on and a “SERIOUS” vibration started – but only when accelerating.
(I thought U-joint or etc…)
Took it to shop last week and found out that 1 of the rebuilt injectors on passenger side had a bad oil o-ring – (when the motor was cold it would start and run until shut off – then – when still warm – no start until it cooled off.) (Found coolant leak = fixed - and they rebuilt oil cooler... again... because it was leaking again = no charge...)
They found 2 bad injectors on passenger side and another injector bad on drivers side – changed 3 injectors total. (out of warranty. #*#&…) they also changed all 8 of the cups.
However – even with all 8 injectors passing contribution test at the shop –

BTW – it has a new fuel pump. Fuel pressure is good.

As of right now – it idles with a slight “miss” but it’s more like a partially plugged injector – and the “SERIOUS” vibration is apparently coming from the motor and is still there when accelerating and motor has absolutely no power – acts like missing – but more like “slightly out of time” IDM signals to the injectors ????
Guys at shop say possibly a bad compression ring / bent rod – or push rod / valve / etc.??? They are not sure?????
They don’t have a way to test compression.
Would a bad IDM cause this? Or bad CPS? Or a clogged EBP tube and sensor – I believe the tube and sensor have nothing to do with the EBPV – my EBPV is disabled – but I have never cleaned / replaced the EBP tube or sensor…

I have a video of what it is doing now - but I am not allowed to post it directly here. (Watch the entire video - at the end it puffs smoke at high RPM???)
w w w . youtube.com/watch?v=t1n6gqcY7O0
 

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Hopefully the shop that did the injectors evacuated the cylinders of fuel and oil before firing it up! If not they could have hydrolocked it (which could bend a rod). I would find a shop that can do a compression check. This isn't a California model 1997 is it? Just want to make sure that they put in correct injectors. Is your EBPV just unplugged electrically? Is so, you can try mechanically disconnecting it and making sure it is fully open. I would also clean the tube and sensor (it comes out fairly easily). IDM seems OK (it seems they are mostly all or nothing). CPS is a cheap try and if it doesn't fix it you'll have a spare (get OEM only). Cheers!
 

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Discussion Starter #4
BTW...
I changed out the ICP when the Transmission Range Sensor was causing the loping idle issue. (I thought it was the ICP - but it turned out to be the TRS)
 

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If you know the EBPV is fully open and you think the Cat may be plugged, disconnect the Cat temporarily and move the connection to the side a bit just to see what happens. Cheers!
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I was looking at that connection - I'll probably have to cut off the clamps and reinstall new ones - but it would be worth it if a clogged CAT is the problem. Going to mess with it when I get time...
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Yesterday - forgot to post this... here...
Update…

I changed the CPS (old one was Oriley Auto – worked for several years – I know – I know – OEM… the new one is also oriley’s… I know, I know…) But….
It runs better with the new Oriley CPS – but still has miss and some vibration…
BUT – it is better than before??????

The ICP was replaced a few months ago (also Oriley… I know, I know – but now there is OIL in the plug connector – again…
BUT – I unplugged the ICP and started the truck – jerky idle – straightened out – but when I put it in gear it died instantly…
I plugged the ICP back in - and it will idle and take throttle – in gear – with brakes applied – but still has the “miss”.

Cant get the EBP tube to unscrew from the exhaust manifold to check / clean / or replace it – soaking it with WD40 and ETC. until I can get the threaded end to “spin” on the tube…)

Re cleaned the FPR screen – a little dirty – but not much change after cleaning…

Fuel pressure at idle with a tire pressure gage = 30 PSI.

Below are a couple of pics of the hood and fire wall with “soot / oil – where there wasn’t any before this issue…
When the issue started – I noticed the “exhaust / or – oil” on the hood and firewall near the turbo.
Maybe a plugged catalytic converter is causing some back pressure at the turbo???
Took off the turbo hoses and only saw a few drops of oil on the blades…
But when revving up the motor – in neutral – like the video shows - it sounds like there is “back pressure” at the turbo???

I just can’t believe that a new CPS would make the difference it did with a little better power and less vibration - if it is a mechanical issue (rings / rod / valve / etc.)
Or – maybe – the other 7 cylinders “came alive” better???

I know, I know – I need a compression check………………………….

Could the IDM or the Computer possibly be the culprit?
 

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If you know the EBPV is fully open and suspect a plugged Cat, you could always disconnect the Cat and move the exhaust out of the way slightly to see what happens. Cheers!
 

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Discussion Starter #10
UPDATE...

I did the "BB" mod on my FPR on the filter bowl = No Difference.

I swapped the IDM with my other truck = No Difference.

I have a new CPS (black with purple O-Ring) on order and a new Motorcraft ICP from Diesel O-Rings.

I don't believe I have a compression problem (valve / ring / push rod) - unless its a bent piston rod because I
placed the oil filler cap upside down over filler hole - revved the motor to 2500 RPM - cap did not move.

The tin nut on my IPR is tight - and from what I understand - usually when the IPR is bad - the motor won't fire or run at all - or does major hiccupping / etc.

Today I'll try unplugging each UVCH - 1 at a time and see if I can find out if it is a particular cylinder "missing".

Mine starts fairly good - and runs - has a "miss" and no power / and the vibration from the "miss" - so it doesn't "act" like its the IPR???

I've downloaded the FORScan app to my PC - and ordering the adapter connector.

BTW -

I just remembered that my son gave me a SCT Flash "tuner / scanner".
I'll hook it up today and see what I can find out with the minimal diagnostics it has to offer...
 

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Discussion Starter #11
UPDATE-

After unplugging the UVC harnesses - 1 at a time - I am certain the problem is on the passenger bank - one of the back 2 cylinders - I believe it is the second to the back (#5)

I ordered and installed Motorcraft (OEM) - CPS and ICP.

The miss is much better - the vibration is minimal. I now think this motor has had this issue for some time as it now runs much closer to what it had felt like for the past 80,000 miles or so - before this latest major issue.

I need to do a compression check - but first I'm going to OHM the injector wires from the IDM harness pins to the injectors and see if possibly the entire issue might be a bad wire in the harness. If it passes the OHM test - then I'll do a compression test.
 

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Wait wait wait, go back, you have only 30psi of fuel pressure at idle? Get that fixed right away, it should be atleast 50psi, 60-70psi recommended.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I'll try the "tire pressure" gauge on the fuel schrader valve again-
When I did it before - there was a lot of fuel "spraying" - so the reading is low - I figure it is probably at least 50 PSI because of how much fuel pressure was spraying out and not going into the gauge...
 

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UPDATE-

The 8 GP's and both UVCG were changed 18 months ago when the 8 injectors were replaced.

Rechecked Fuel Pressure with 50 psi tire gauge at idle - got it to seal - buried the gauge - so I must have at least 60 PSI fuel pressure at idle.
However -
I checked the resistance from the IDM connector to all 8 cylinders.
All good -except for #7 - no resistance. (continuity is good from IDM connector - to - motor harness plug... must be somewhere from UVCG to injector)

Been storming here - I started removing the VC - but got rained out.

I'll try to find out if its the UVCG connector / or the harness inside / or the injector itself - so I know what's going on and what to order...
 

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On the injector itself, it could just be a bad solenoid. Check the resistance of it while you're there. Cheers!
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Just read that if an injector is "mechanically" bad - there will be NO CEL light-
But if it is an electrical problem with the injector - the CEL will light - (and possibly the IDM will shut down that bank...?)

Is this true?

I do not have a CEL - or any codes - - - is the injector incurring a mechanical (or o-ring) failure???
Because when I unplug the rear passenger (cylinders #5 & #7) there is very little difference in idle - but all of the other 3 make a noticeable difference

Well 1 code - P1111 - but it won't clear...
 

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Discussion Starter #18
NEW UPDATE -

Got the passenger side VC off... (what do you guys use to remove the back bolt? - It was a bitch for me - I don't have a flex extension...^%$(*&^#[email protected])

Any way-

I think the shop might have FU&KED me because...
After I removed the passenger side VC - I saw that the GP wire on #7 insulation was "scraped back" in 2 places & it gave a + continuity for a short to the oil that would "accumulate / pass by" it ...)

Then I OHMED the UVCH at the outer VC connection - on injector #7 - and NO RESISTANCE...
But the inner harness shows good continuity between the Outer UVCH plug - and the injector plug.....
Then I took off the solenoid - and there was a layer of oil between the solenoid - and - the injector actuator...

That has to be the "short" in the injector function / OHM reading...............

So... Either the "rebuilt" injector had a bad seal at the solenoid - or...................

They didn't even change that injector ------ a year and a half ago... and it's an original??????

The solenoids on cylinders 1, 3, and 5 have YELLOW solenoid covers with a AA marked on them...

BUT - the #7 solenoid Injector is a dark Brown / Black color and looks different - with a A00 #

What color are the original FORD injector Solenoids??????????????

Either way - the shop will say " the injector was bad when it came to us".......

And I could ask if they did an OHM check - after starting it - and it ran like #### - but they simply told me that "it didn't have any power".......

The dumb ass - money hungry - FUC$TARDS.....

Either...
I (they) got a badly sealed solenoid - or - they never changed it in the first place 18 months ago..............................

I MO B GETTIN EVEN with someone..........

I'll contact Rosewood and see if they can hook me up with an injector.......

Any thoughts or comments are greatly appreciated - from you experienced guys here on these forums!!!!!!!!!

AudioWriter....
 

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I'm on 4 different forums for these things! If you ohm the solenoid directly at it's connection port, you should get around 3 ohms. Similarly if you connect the UVCH to it and ohm it at either the UVCH connector to the VC or at the VC with the UVCH connected, you should get the same. You would be measuring from the center pin to the appropriate immediately adjacent inner pin. The outermost pins are for the glowplugs and you should not get any continuity with the immediate adjacent inner pin. Cheers!
 

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NEW UPDATE -

Got the passenger side VC off... (what do you guys use to remove the back bolt? - It was a bitch for me - I don't have a flex extension...^%$(*&^#[email protected])

Any way-

I think the shop might have FU&KED me because...
After I removed the passenger side VC - I saw that the GP wire on #7 insulation was "scraped back" in 2 places & it gave a + continuity for a short to the oil that would "accumulate / pass by" it ...)

Then I OHMED the UVCH at the outer VC connection - on injector #7 - and NO RESISTANCE...
But the inner harness shows good continuity between the Outer UVCH plug - and the injector plug.....
Then I took off the solenoid - and there was a layer of oil between the solenoid - and - the injector actuator...

That has to be the "short" in the injector function / OHM reading...............

So... Either the "rebuilt" injector had a bad seal at the solenoid - or...................

They didn't even change that injector ------ a year and a half ago... and it's an original??????

The solenoids on cylinders 1, 3, and 5 have YELLOW solenoid covers with a AA marked on them...

BUT - the #7 solenoid Injector is a dark Brown / Black color and looks different - with a A00 #

What color are the original FORD injector Solenoids??????????????

Either way - the shop will say " the injector was bad when it came to us".......

And I could ask if they did an OHM check - after starting it - and it ran like #### - but they simply told me that "it didn't have any power".......

The dumb ass - money hungry - FUC$TARDS.....

Either...
I (they) got a badly sealed solenoid - or - they never changed it in the first place 18 months ago..............................

I MO B GETTIN EVEN with someone..........

I'll contact Rosewood and see if they can hook me up with an injector.......

Any thoughts or comments are greatly appreciated - from you experienced guys here on these forums!!!!!!!!!

AudioWriter....
Slow down slow down. Dont jump the gun here just yet. A layer of oil between the solenoid and the injector body is normal if I remember correctly... the solenoid covers being bright yellow means they're just new, not different, they all USE to look like that, but oil and age have tarnished all your other ones.

ALL solenoids work the same as well, so just because they are stamped AA, doesnt mean they are AA injectors, but they just happened to use AA solenoids, again, nothing wrong with that.

As for the number 7, it could be the same thing, but just a much older injector. There's no telling what an injector REALLY is, until you have it flow tested.

Try what Patrick has suggested and get back to us, hes a fairly fart smeller and has been known to be spot on with his diagnosis.
 
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