[roosterdiesel]

Here's the numbers I have for the various HEUI sticks.

They don't correlate with what I've read on the net over the years. So I'm wondering how the numbers, posted all the time, have been derived. what test conditions were they done at?

 

[TerminatorEngineering]

They usually measure with 1000 hits, and probably more then 1.5 ms of pw.

 

[roosterdiesel]

I know they use 1000 strokes, that's how they get cc's. There's 1000 cubic mm's in one cc. I use this daily when I have an injection pump on the test stand at work.

So if a BD stick flows 151-169 cubic mm/stroke according to the chart, that's 151-169 cc's per 1000 strokes. So to get 250 cc's out of the they are running more than 2.5 ms PW??? I see that unlikely. Does 500 more psi of ICP make that big of a difference?

 

[gregrob]

I have seen 6ms of PW

 

[Tim @ P.I.S.]

Its probly right on. Think for a second, AA's come in 94-most 96/97's.

They are advertised at 73mm^3 on the VC from IH. I have scanned many of these trucks and seen 3000psi oil on them stock, with PW just under 2 ms.

So if that were cut to 2500psi and 1.5 ms PW, that about equals out.

I would bet money this list is for IH applications more so than ford. Because SD's have more than 1.7-1.9ms PW.

 

[Charles]

My injectors (BD's) flow 248cc/1000 at 4ms 2700ish ICP. Wich means that they actually empty in something under 4ms.

If I were to run say 3ms, they would probably flow something in the 200cc range. Run say, 1800psi at 2ms....probably 180ish.

The flow is what it is. If somebody wants to set a standard, then I suggested 4ms, 2800psi and 1000 shots. That is a good average for WOT.

When I want to test to see them for cruising, I run 1100 or 1200 or so and about 2ms. About what you would expect when actually cruising.

Those numbers looked to be pretty normal from what I could read ( I couldn't enlarge it).

I pushed 325cc's/1000 through a bone stock 7 hole powerstroke nozzle at one time in around 6ms. But the pressures were so high that the consistency at full pressure was not good between injectors, and the injectors themselves did not last long. That same set did around 180 or so cc's/1000 at 4ms and high ICP. They made 428rwhp on that 180ish cc's of fuel as well.

Injector flow can be a crazy thing. Some of the effects that pressure and tme can have are FAR from intuitive.

 

[Haul_n_horses2]

My injectors (BD's) flow 248cc/1000 at 4ms 2700ish ICP. Wich means that they actually empty in something under 4ms.

If I were to run say 3ms, they would probably flow something in the 200cc range. Run say, 1800psi at 2ms....probably 180ish.

The flow is what it is. If somebody wants to set a standard, then I suggested 4ms, 2800psi and 1000 shots. That is a good average for WOT.

When I want to test to see them for cruising, I run 1100 or 1200 or so and about 2ms. About what you would expect when actually cruising.

Those numbers looked to be pretty normal from what I could read ( I couldn't enlarge it).

I pushed 325cc's/1000 through a bone stock 7 hole powerstroke nozzle at one time in around 6ms. But the pressures were so high that the consistency at full pressure was not good between injectors, and the injectors themselves did not last long. That same set did around 180 or so cc's/1000 at 4ms and high ICP. They made 428rwhp on that 180ish cc's of fuel as well.

Injector flow can be a crazy thing. Some of the effects that pressure and tme can have are FAR from intuitive.

This is why Dynomite Diesel do not describe the flow through their EH'ed injectors in cc's. The mm^3/1000 injection events can vary all over the map depending on pressure, pulse width etc.

 

[Charles]

At least a cc's/1000 at blank pressure and blank pw tells you something

A flow number in cc's per time or lbs per time tells you Nothing at all. Unit injectors need to be measured per injection event. You can measure a nozzle in flow rate, a unit injector must be measured per event. A dodge, or chevy "injector" is nothing but a nozzle. In that case, lbs/min or cc's per min or something similar is 100% the way to do it.

When the injector has a fixed volume flow and is it's own injection pump.....you simply cannot do that and expect it to mean a thing.

Not to mention, when they do their flow testing, they are still assuming some value for ICP.

Two Cents.

 

[Haul_n_horses2]

At least a cc's/1000 at blank pressure and blank pw tells you something

A flow number in cc's per time or lbs per time tells you Nothing at all. Unit injectors need to be measured per injection event. You can measure a nozzle in flow rate, a unit injector must be measured per event. A dodge, or chevy "injector" is nothing but a nozzle. In that case, lbs/min or cc's per min or something similar is 100% the way to do it.

When the injector has a fixed volume flow and is it's own injection pump.....you simply cannot do that and expect it to mean a thing.

Not to mention, when they do their flow testing, they are still assuming some value for ICP.

Two Cents.

That was my point so depending on ICP, pw etc. a vendor could advertise an injector as flowing x ccs and another vendor could advertise the same injector as 1.5x ccs.

 

[Tim @ P.I.S.]

Instead most dealers advertise what the maximum stroke is of the IP in realation to the size of fuel area. 28.27mm^3 for A code plungers and 39.59mm^3 fr B codes.

That would be the maximum available for injection if the injector had suffencent ICP and PW.

 

[UNLIMITED_DIESEL]

What he said ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^

 

[roosterdiesel]

At least a cc's/1000 at blank pressure and blank pw tells you something f......Not to mention, when they do their flow testing, they are still assuming some value for ICP.

Two Cents.

Thanks for you #s Charlie! I take it your nozzles larger than stock BD nozzles.

I completely agree with you on unit injectors, we need to know a measurement per event.


I'm guessing that all these years that people have posted 140ish cc for ADs and 90ish for AA's that they have know clue what ICP and PW these numbers were derived from.

 

[Tim @ P.I.S.]

I'm guessing that all these years that people have posted 140ish cc for ADs and 90ish for AA's that they have know clue what ICP and PW these numbers were derived from.

Actually, the ones that flowed them for that info should know, the machine they used would tell them this info.

 

[roosterdiesel]

So people have been posting those numbers on boards with no clue of the test conditions?:lame: I hope the AC's I just ordered today at work actually flow more than my ADs.:ford:


Anyone know who found out the #s usually posted? I guess I'll have to call my Memphis store to see if I can talk them into finding what magical #s it takes to hit the 140cc with ADs.

 

[Charles]

Ahhh, it's not majic, it's empty.

When an AD has "shot it's load" it will have displaced ~140ish cc's when someone says it is a 140cc injector. I believe they usually move a tad bit more than that though don't they? Can't remember, it's been a while since I lived on the flowbench.

My injectors flow 248mm^3 when emptied. I don't care what ICP or pw you used to get there, that is what you get at the end of the day everyday.

Hence the reason they are 248cc injectors anywhere in the world, anytime you want to test them.