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How does the factory system ensure the HPOP Reservoir stays filled under extended WOT runs? How have the various big oil manufacturers allowed for increased oil capacitiy needed in the reservoir. I notice the Gen 3 from Swamps has an extra supply line to the unit. Is there any problems with replacement pumps or other systems that do not supplement reservoir capacity?

Just wondering,
Matt R
 

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How does the factory system ensure the HPOP Reservoir stays filled under extended WOT runs? How have the various big oil manufacturers allowed for increased oil capacitiy needed in the reservoir. I notice the Gen 3 from Swamps has an extra supply line to the unit. Is there any problems with replacement pumps or other systems that do not supplement reservoir capacity?

Just wondering,
Matt R

Doesn't the Termy "Remote IPR" dump freshly aerated oil from the IPR outlet right back into the reservoir? While the oil quality may be questionable, it should be no problem for that to maintain the oil pressure in the reservoir.
 

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Doesn't the Termy "Remote IPR" dump freshly aerated oil from the IPR outlet right back into the reservoir? While the oil quality may be questionable, it should be no problem for that to maintain the oil pressure in the reservoir.
:doh: Charles, you cease to amaze me.....................your just oooozzzzing with wizdumb or is it stupidity?

I think my IQ is dropping a point everytime I read one of your theories.:doh:

Matt, I use the Remote IPR for two reasons.
1) Easy access to the IPR
2) It does keep the reservoir full and the low pressure pump has no problem keeping up. About 5% of my customers were seeing a pressure drop at WOT before the R-IPR was added. Some tried adding an external line from the port near the oil filter, but then worried about pressure drops to the lower end.
3) Another option is an external cooler can also be added in race applications using the R-IPR port to help keep the oil cooler.
 

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:doh: Charles, you cease to amaze me.....................your just oooozzzzing with wizdumb or is it stupidity?

I think my IQ is dropping a point everytime I read one of your theories.:doh:

Matt, I use the Remote IPR for two reasons.
1) Easy access to the IPR
2) It does keep the reservoir full and the low pressure pump has no problem keeping up. About 5% of my customers were seeing a pressure drop at WOT before the R-IPR was added. Some tried adding an external line from the port near the oil filter, but then worried about pressure drops to the lower end.
3) Another option is an external cooler can also be added in race applications using the R-IPR port to help keep the oil cooler.

You're pumping oil from the relief valve directly back to the pump inlet. This isn't rocket science. That's not a good idea, you have created heat and aeration when the oil goes from 3000+psi to ~30 or so psi in microseconds across an orifice. Waste oil should have time to cool and de-aerate before being returned to the pump. The reservoir is the oil pan. The oil is consumed from the reservoir atop the front cover so quickly it has no time to do anything but travel directly back through the pump. Hydraulics 101.

I don't care what that means to you. It is what it is. When you have people working on ways to give this oil time to simmer before even returning it to the lube oil pump, shooting it straight back into the high pressure system is not the brightest idea. Yes, it solves a potential brief oil starvation issue at startup, but degrades the system efficiency while driving the other 99.9% of the time the truck is running.

Joey, what reason would I have to believe you had ever actually done worthwhile testing on anything? Why should I ever think that you would be doing something because it made sense after thorough testing? 3800+psi ICP and dumping this oil right back to the pump are just a couple demonstrations of your conceptual prowess with the Heui system.

Give me a break man.
 

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:doh: Charles, you cease to amaze me.....................your just oooozzzzing with wizdumb or is it stupidity?
joey i hate to say this, but i think charles has a better idea of whats going on than you do. he may come across wrong to some and sound like an #######, but he's tested enough stuff to know what works and what doesnt. One things for sure, I know which one of you id allow to properly size a set of compounds for me.... it would not be you, mr back pressure wizzard:doh::pointlaugh:
 

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Cummins Power
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Explain to me where the air comes from in a sealed system?
 

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Explain to me where the air comes from in a sealed system?
Why does a restrictive fuel filter cause fuel aeration? Is it "air"? No, it's the same fluid you're pumping in a Vapor state. At a certain heat/pressure any fluid will change states to a gas. This is why a fuel system is sometimes referred to as being "Vapor Locked" when restriction is too great for the pump to get adequate fuel in liquid form to maintain a prime.

Although I don't have a camera in there.... the aeration is damn sure there when you run high rpm/low pw and blast a ton of oil across the IPR that damn sure isn't there if you keep the pw up, and keep the oil going through the poppets and not across the IPR.

The IPR is a HUGE source of aeration on these engines. Always has been. To purposefully blow that right back into the pumps is less than brilliant IMO.

If I'm wrong I'm wrong. But it'll take more than comments about IQ to come to a conclusion one way or the other.
 

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Cummins Power
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Have you looked at this through a site glass or out the end of an open hose? The fuel aeration is the release of entrained air most likely from the fuel sloshing in the tank.
 

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Ok, Charles I have been playing with hydraulics since you were still in diapers(early 80's). I have a few of my pumps running around the country. If it were an issue, I damn sure would know about it.

As for aeration: the R-IPR is on the same circuit as the high pressure oil lines. With your the theory, the injectors are getting aerated oil as well. Also, remember, I'm using piston pumps with really tight tolerances, unlike the loose gear pumps that you are using.

Luke, give me a break: You hate to say what? Last I checked, I build and design High Pressure Oil Systems. If the system didn't work, I would know after almost 5 years.

Matt, anytime you have a question, just PM me. It's just easier.
 

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Cummins Power
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LOL I got a little bit of an education on oil over the past couple days. Whether it's right or not IDK.
 

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Ok, Charles I have been playing with hydraulics since you were still in diapers(early 80's). I have a few of my pumps running around the country. If it were an issue, I damn sure would know about it.

As for aeration: the R-IPR is on the same circuit as the high pressure oil lines. With your the theory, the injectors are getting aerated oil as well. Also, remember, I'm using piston pumps with really tight tolerances, unlike the loose gear pumps that you are using.

Luke, give me a break: You hate to say what? Last I checked, I build and design High Pressure Oil Systems. If the system didn't work, I would know after almost 5 years.

Matt, anytime you have a question, just PM me. It's just easier.

If you think the oil quality is the same traveling through the lines to the heads as that having blasted across the IPR with a pressure differential of oh, 99% in microseconds you may need to work another 40 years with hydraulics and come talk to me then. Do you understand how a nozzle works? Lets assume for a second that blasting all that oil across the IPR (nozzle) does not produce atomization (as your injector nozzles do), you're still pumping hot oil right back to the pump inlet. Want to kill a powersteering pump? Go hold it against the relief and let it keep sucking on it's own outlet oil after it runs across the relief. Heat goes up something fierce.

Kevin, the "air" in the fuel is because diesel fuel is only liquid at a certain temperature/pressure combination (as is any liquid). If you raise the temperature high enough at sea level it will boil. You can do this yourself if you want to see fuel boil. Fill a pot with diesel and put it on the stove till it boils. Are those "air" bubbles rushing to the surface and popping? No, it's diesel fuel vapor.

The other way to boil a liquid is to reduce the pressure. Ever seen a restriction gauge on a fuel system pre-pump? That's telling you how much you're dropping the pressure below ambient. Some people like to call this vacuum. For any given temperature, if you drop the pressure far enough the diesel will boil just the same.

When you have hot fuel (like after it passes through the head rails in a flow-through system and you use it like a coolant) it's hot and if you then have a restrictive pump inlet, because of a restrictive filter, lines or fittings, you are now dropping the pressure as well as raising the temperature. At some point the fuel will begin to vaporize (boil), and you can start seeing the "air" in the lines. This is why it's so much worse with a clogged up filter, and why it will kill a fuel pump/injection pump. The "air" collapses in the pump and can do very, very bad things. No to mention, diesel fuel isn't very lubricating in vapor form.
 

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Cummins Power
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Oil aeration is a chemical reaction caused when the oil film between two moving parts gets too thin and breaks down the anti wear additive. Or from the oil trapping air in an open environment like a differential.
 

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Cummins Power
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Charles I completely understand what you are saying. Do we know at what pressures and temperatures that happens. The RIPR returning to the res, the pressure never goes to zero.
 

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Charles, did you just say liquid becomes vapor when it drops below ambient atmoshperic pressure?

Are you sure when the bubbles form that it is not the chemical compound of the oil releasing O2?
 

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Charles I completely understand what you are saying. Do we know at what pressures and temperatures that happens. The RIPR returning to the res, the pressure never goes to to zero.
No, it just drops 99% from 3000+ to about 30 or less.

Define "zero". Is that atmosphere (14.7psia)? Or a perfect "vacuum" at 0psia? Or maybe 25psia like in the reservoir?
 

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you know that rough crappy idle ya get when you beat the crap out of your truck and let off of it ya get for a few seconds.

go and dump your ipr bypass somewhere else and give it time to settle and bam that goes away.

how do you think we know this

Travis

oh yeah the original swamps oil pumps dumped back into the resivoir, they dont anymore for a reason
 

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Trav my truck has never done that with the Termy. Even when we live tuned it and ran it to 4500 it came down to an idle just fine. I had a bad injector from II and it would act stupid.
 
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