I want to build a motor built for towing. I want numbers around 400hp and 800ft/lbs. It needs to be reliable and last a long time. In theory, I would like to build it from the inside out and have it be capable of 400 hp before I go after injectors and a tuner....not sure how possible that is, but the way I see it, I have 444 cubic inches to play with so it shouldn't be a problem. the plan I have so far is to purchase a quality rebuild kit with .030 pistons. A new set of forged rods. Find a bigger cam (suggestions would be helpful) open up the heads and install bigger valves and springs. If I can do a full roller set up for the valve train I would like to. (Again suggestions on the valvetrain will be helpful) Also planning on doing a main bearing stud kit and a head stud kit. The trans is a ZF 6 speed, not really planning on doing much with it other than a good clutch. I know fuel delivery is a big factor in this equation too. I have already done the "hutch mod" and put a new spring in the FPR housing along with a new fuel pump, that netted me 72psi of fuel pressure. In my opinion that's pretty good. should be able to run some slightly bigger injectors without an issue. I am planning on running a new HPOP, and doing the crossover kit to make sure all injectors are getting the fuel they need. For the turbo...not too sure yet. It is an early 99 and im not sure how much power that turbo is able to support. I know I could make 400 hp pretty easily with some big injectors, a mean tune and a water methanol system but that isn't the way I want to make it, I wanna do the old school way and build it from the inside out to do what I want it to. Now I could be 100% wrong in my plan here, and if I am, someone please tell me. but any info that could be passed this way on building this engine would be appreciated.
johneisenman
well you see, you need fuel to make power. if you don't upgrade the injectors for more volume or get a tune to call for more pulse width to inject more fuel you're never gonna make any more power. pis 175/30, modded h2e, or s366 and a healthy 17 degree hpop or a honey badger jr from nltd with some nltd tunes and call it a day. you're never gonna tow heavy at 400 horse anyway because its just so hard to keep cool.
well I know you need fuel to make power, that is why I said im putting slightly bigger injectors in it, new HPOP, and a tuner. but you need air to burn that fuel otherwise your just wasting it and running your EGT"s thru the roof, that is the reason for all the head work, more air in the combustion chamber means more power. The reason for the roller setup in the valvetrain is less friction, less friction means more power. And a bigger cylinder bore gives me more room for that added fuel and air mixture which makes a bigger explosion and that means more power. If I just wanted to bolt stuff on an engine and go hotrod around town then your suggestions would be fine, but that isn't what I want to do. I already have to rebuild this motor due to the fact that it is tired so why not do it the right way. I do appreciate your suggestions on a HPOP and a turbo though. And I do belive 400hp is a towable power level, as long as you build the motor for it, as long as I have enough air in the combustion chamber to burn every last bit of fuel that I shove in to it, and precise timing on the injector pulse then EGT's shouldn't be an issue. So again...does anyone have a suggestion on a cam, valve size, valve springs ect
You're prolly an old gasser guy. Ported heads and cams do help, I'm not sayin that, but they're not as beneficial as they are in a N/A engine because we have turbos to force air in the cylinders and 10, 20, 30+ psi so we can generally get enough air in to clean up the fuel. They guys who benefit from the cams and heads are the guys runnin huge injectors at a competition level. I've only seen one set of roller rockers and those we on an hrt built pullin engine. I'll say it again, performance injection systems 175/30 injectors, modded h2e, or 66mm equivalent turbo, honey badger jr would make a dang fine towin combo. More than a zf wants anyway
thanks! i'll go post a thread over at PSA, and if I have to rebuild the entire motor either way then why not spend a little extra and have what I want. the cost of a rebuild kit with stock pistons or .030 pistons is basically the same, with the heads I need to have new valves, springs and guides put in along with a little machine work to give me a fresh new surface, so whats a little more machine work to port and polish and make room for bigger valves. I need to replace the cam so why not spend a little more and get a better one......its not like I just decided I want more power so im gonna rebuild the engine...if I just wanted more power than yeah id go and just bolt sh*t on and call it good till it blew up but that isn't the case...this engine is tired, its worn out, its done its time, it needs a rebuild...so that's what is gonna happen
Take it for what its worth, but if your only wanting 400hp, then your current plan is just throwing money down the drain. For 400hp all you need is a decent fuel system, decent HPOP, and some bigger injectors. A stock turbo will make 400+, but they don't like it. Mines lasted 6k miles with the current injectors, and i run the crap out of it, but yesterday i had a bearing failure of some sorts. Plan is to pick up another used stocker to throw on for now, and keep saving up for something a lot bigger.
If you want to do some "engine work" then do a Melling LPOP, head studs and a decent set of valve springs and pushrods. Don't waste your time or money on a re-build unless your going to get some billet rods, and shoot for a lot of power.
If you want to do some "engine work" then do a Melling LPOP, head studs and a decent set of valve springs and pushrods. Don't waste your time or money on a re-build unless your going to get some billet rods, and shoot for a lot of power.
400hp you don't need any of that crap, this list will get you 400hp
200/30 hybrid injectors
D66 turbo
Frx
Napa 6637 or afe big boost intake
4" dp to 4" exhaust
gauges (pryo, boost)
Custom tuned TS 6 position chip
Clutch: single disk south bend or a comparable single disk
HPOP: T500 (not really needed unless your current on is crappy)
200/30 hybrid injectors
D66 turbo
Frx
Napa 6637 or afe big boost intake
4" dp to 4" exhaust
gauges (pryo, boost)
Custom tuned TS 6 position chip
Clutch: single disk south bend or a comparable single disk
HPOP: T500 (not really needed unless your current on is crappy)
"Very worn" is a really loose term on these motors compared to gassers.
Chances are you'll have a much more reliable setup taking the money you want to use on the engine and applying it to a turbo kit thats proven bulletproof at that level, and some small injectors than you will with a stock turbo on your precieved version.
Btw, you will probably gain absolutely nothing at that level by going to rollers.
Except valve adjustments. Definitely better off stock for reliability.
Chances are you'll have a much more reliable setup taking the money you want to use on the engine and applying it to a turbo kit thats proven bulletproof at that level, and some small injectors than you will with a stock turbo on your precieved version.
Btw, you will probably gain absolutely nothing at that level by going to rollers.
Except valve adjustments. Definitely better off stock for reliability.
you are wasting money in valve train parts. If you want it reliable all is need is springs and pushrods. There is a truck in the mid 10s with nitrous on a STOCK CAM, STOCK VALVES AND NO PORTING. There is no need for a cam. 400hp is VERY basic. A little bit larger than stock injectors, turbo for EGTs, and stock HPOP should be fine as long as it is in good working order. Only other thing you will need is a fuel system. Take the money you were going to use for cam/rebuild and put it towards and intercooler if you want.
Still a good read. Has me curious about a few things. I'd like to think I'm over 400hp with my mods. Didn't change injectors though. Still on stock AD's. Stock everything except 4" dp/exhaust and 6637. But able to push 35psi with a KC300x turbo on a php hydra 100hp tune. Not the kind of rig I'll ever dyno, and of course a lot of that is lost through the r4100, super long driveshaft, and DRW rear end. But from I read at the time. Should be a setup that sees 400-430hp for others.
I like to tell people diesels it is not about hp, it is all in the torque.
A 190 hp 450 torque diesel will output a 500hp 120 torque Honda civic every day of the week and twice on sunday
A 190 hp 450 torque diesel will output a 500hp 120 torque Honda civic every day of the week and twice on sunday
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