Ford Power Stroke Nation banner

1 - 20 of 30 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,007 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Particularly asking about the typical stage one injector.

Most injector builders offer a stage one injector that flows ~160cc's with a stock nozzle and/or brand new Alliant AC's which are also rated at 160cc's and have a stock nozzle. Typically the aftermarket built injectors are less money than the new AC's. What are the pro's and con's of the new versus built injectors? Are new injectors worth the extra dough? Is expected longevity the same with both injectors?

Educate me. :ford:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,007 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Who are you lookin to buy from? That makes a difference.

I'm runnin a "reman" with no issues.
I specifically didn't mention any individual builders or companies. I am sure that builders have their trade secrets they won't share and that's OK. I am wondering why anybody ever sold a set of AC's if aftermarket builders could put together a better product for less money?
 

·
<<< Power
Joined
·
3,456 Posts
Well, I guess look at like buyin a used car from a good mechanic. He's gonna sell it cheaper than a new car because it cost him less. But that don't make the used car any less reliable.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,081 Posts
A few things come to mind.
1) If you got 300k miles out of your set, and you want to be sure to get 300k miles more, then go with a new set.

2) Not all parts are even available for replacement in a rebuild.

3) Almost all of the older AA's I work have bad Plunger & Barrels which need to be replaced, so make sure that dollar is figured in upfront just in case.

4) In the end you get what you pay for. A $500 set of overhauled Stage-1's are not the same as a set of Brand New AC's. With new Plunger & Barrels and new Nozzles they should last you a very long time, however. Consider the expense of this vs a brand new set and some guys just go with all new (see #2 above).

EDIT: I just realized this is in the SD forum. If you wanted Single Shot Stage-1 injectors in your 2000, you have to add some $$ parts for the conversion. Going with new AC's, you send yours in for cores and it doesn't matter.
 

·
Sponsor
Joined
·
1,583 Posts
I will add to what Jim stated.

In my experience the alliant powers are good injectors. However, there are certain things that we can do in our remans to make them a bit better than the new ones... I'm not gonna let the cat outta the bag, but I don't see why a set of remans couldn't last you 300,000 miles if they are taken care of (fuel filter and oil changes).

I guess what i'm getting at is, unless you are dead set on NEW injectors for your truck, I would stick with the remans... They are cheaper and IMHO they are better.

One main difference that I can tell you is that Alliant makes all their injectors to meet specs, however you might get some on the low side and some on the high side... They can't tell you because they don't test them. When you get a set of remans, we are spending time on them getting everything balanced at every key point in the RPM band. That makes a huge difference in performance, idle, and longevity.
 

·
OEM Moderator
Joined
·
9,381 Posts
I will add to what Jim stated.

In my experience the alliant powers are good injectors. However, there are certain things that we can do in our remans to make them a bit better than the new ones... I'm not gonna let the cat outta the bag, but I don't see why a set of remans couldn't last you 300,000 miles if they are taken care of (fuel filter and oil changes).

I guess what i'm getting at is, unless you are dead set on NEW injectors for your truck, I would stick with the remans... They are cheaper and IMHO they are better.

One main difference that I can tell you is that Alliant makes all their injectors to meet specs, however you might get some on the low side and some on the high side... They can't tell you because they don't test them. When you get a set of remans, we are spending time on them getting everything balanced at every key point in the RPM band. That makes a huge difference in performance, idle, and longevity.
If one wanted to get a set of New AC's what do you two charge to go through them and get them nice and balanced if that is an option?
 

·
Village Idiot
Joined
·
8,209 Posts
Dang beat me to it ..
Sound like the best rout is a modded new inj that has been balanced and blueprinted so to speak.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,007 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
A few things come to mind.
1) If you got 300k miles out of your set, and you want to be sure to get 300k miles more, then go with a new set.

2) Not all parts are even available for replacement in a rebuild.

3) Almost all of the older AA's I work have bad Plunger & Barrels which need to be replaced, so make sure that dollar is figured in upfront just in case.

4) In the end you get what you pay for. A $500 set of overhauled Stage-1's are not the same as a set of Brand New AC's. With new Plunger & Barrels and new Nozzles they should last you a very long time, however. Consider the expense of this vs a brand new set and some guys just go with all new (see #2 above).

EDIT: I just realized this is in the SD forum. If you wanted Single Shot Stage-1 injectors in your 2000, you have to add some $$ parts for the conversion. Going with new AC's, you send yours in for cores and it doesn't matter.
Thanks for the input. I did not know about "#2", that not all parts are available...like I said, I am always looking for more education on these injectors.

I will add to what Jim stated.

In my experience the alliant powers are good injectors. However, there are certain things that we can do in our remans to make them a bit better than the new ones... I'm not gonna let the cat outta the bag, but I don't see why a set of remans couldn't last you 300,000 miles if they are taken care of (fuel filter and oil changes).

I guess what i'm getting at is, unless you are dead set on NEW injectors for your truck, I would stick with the remans... They are cheaper and IMHO they are better.

One main difference that I can tell you is that Alliant makes all their injectors to meet specs, however you might get some on the low side and some on the high side... They can't tell you because they don't test them. When you get a set of remans, we are spending time on them getting everything balanced at every key point in the RPM band. That makes a huge difference in performance, idle, and longevity.
I kinda figured there was some secrets inside some of these injectors. :ford: Personally I am always interested in my vehicles running correctly and not necessarily interested in maximum HP/TQ.

I can appreciate the time involved in building these injectors and things like balance, performance, idle, and longevity are all very important to me.

Thanks for the input, keep it coming!
 

·
Need a ride.
Joined
·
553 Posts
Great thread, remans verus new has sparked my interest too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,007 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
FWIW I do well into the hundreds of overhauled/reman sets per year, and sell maybe 4 or 5 new sets a year.
That makes sense with the prices that are listed. Good stuff!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
105 Posts
What kind of power will the AC's make with an H2E? I have been told its a nice combination. I'm ready to pull the trigger.
 

·
Demon Dually
Joined
·
5,140 Posts
:popcorn:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
Who are you lookin to buy from? That makes a difference.

I'm runnin a "reman" with no issues.
I'm looking at Beans 250/100 Hybrids. Any thoughts on their products. New verses Reman?? I'm still can't decide. $680 bucks buys alot of other parts for my build.
 

·
Edward Scissorhand WanaB
Joined
·
1,995 Posts
You will be happy with the remans from Beans. Full Force Diesel is the company who builds the injectors for Beans. Call and talk to Casserly at Full Force and talk over your concerns and questions with him.
 

·
Simple is best
Joined
·
281 Posts
My experience thus far has been that I am very happy with the reman injectors I bought. Something you may want to consider, which I have not seen mentioned yet, is service. You can spend a lot on NEW injectors, but if you are like most of us, you are doing other things to your truck. At some point you will want some good advice, troubleshooting help, and additional parts for your truck. Most injector builders are enthusiasts who do other things that compliment the injectors. Service after the sale, to me, is important. IMHO, having one shop do all of my fuel delivery components (tuning, sticks, idm, etc) is the way to go because it makes troubleshooting easier, greater confidence in the "matching" of everything, and no finger pointing at other vendors. I have been very happy with Swamps.
 

·
<<< THE GAUGE WHORE...
Joined
·
12,082 Posts
Extreamly happy with the NEW AC's I installed in Chelseas Excursion. Fired right up, runs PERFECT and I know there are a set of injectors in there that are brand new, not someone's cores.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,865 Posts
But you do not know how perfectly they are flow balanced becasue they have not been on a flow bench of someone that is providing you with a spec sheet and guarantee of it. I am not saying that is needed for everyone and maybe its less of an issue at lower flow rates like stage Is. But it seems to me if I was gonna go with brand new I woudl still pay Nate ( my injector builder of choice) to go thru them and get them dialed in as well as is possible. There are VERY few things that come from OEM that can not be improved upon. Everything OEM is always a balance of a bean counter's cost sheet. Durbality cost, performance, warranty replacement, bla bla bla GO to a perf shop and you are paying for a more perf that would not be considered cost effective to a OEM where to them its good enough.

I would THINK the ideal would be a new set modded.
 
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
Top