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Discussion Starter #1
First I have a 04 f350 with the 6.0 build date 10/06/03. Parts replaced since owning it for the last year Trans rebuilt new everything (but case). New water pump, and radiator, engine harness, injector Harness, Glow plugs and harnesses, Rebuilt the ficm (4 bad points), CAC tubes and boots (one was blown), IPR 2 times, ICP, Erg Deleted, New OEM Injectors, New OEM Hpop, Battery's (weren't matching when I got it ), Dummy plugs and stand tubes. resealed High pressure rails. So with all that being done I would think It would run like a champ an have no problems. Nope yet again I'm wrong Like normal. But this issue I have is called a no start hot with the add on of it will start no problem when cool. The truck Idles no problem no smoke icp and IPR in range but i can be driving down the road and it just shuts off no warning no nothing just dies. Local shop is stumped and so am I i work with fords a lot and I have a scan tool with live data and everything sows fine and then as i said poof at first it will restart but once fully up to temp no go long crank but no start. bought the truck with 181,000 on it the truck only has 184,000 on it now. the truck has no codes on it at this point im at a loss with it im about to shoot it. any help would be great. I have put over 4500 into it. Only thing I haven't done is the oil cooler But from my understanding even if it is going bad it should not shut the truck down please correct me if Im wrong on that :ford:
 

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EA - Eggfarts Anonymous!
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welcome to the forum!
the oil cooler itself will not shut the truck down, but if the oil temp get up to it's upper threshhold (265F i think?), the truck will go into limp mode i believe. shouldn't die, just defuels.
I have read that an bad oil temp sensor can cause similar stall & no start problems. do you have a monitor to view the EOT? if you do, i'm sure the other guys will ask for other parameters as well
 

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"resident smarty pants"
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When it becomes a no-start, then we need cranking data posted.

ICP pressure, psig
ICP volts
IPR duty cycle
FICM MPower (main power)
FICM LPower (logic power)
battery voltage
V-reference voltage
rpm

What are you reading codes with?

Have you done a bubble test (fuel bowl check for bubbles when cranking)?
 

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Have you done an air leak test on the HPO system? That will help pinpoint if there's a leak. I have heard of the IPR being faulty in a few cases when it's so seemingly random, but not always. I would start with the leak test and with doing a search for a hot no start and seeing what everyone else has tried. Sucks to hear and not get a definitive answer, but there are so many potential causes that you'll have to start the process of elimination. One thing which may help is if your scan tool can do recall....can it? Seeing what the numbers look like while it dies would be tremendously helpful. Next best would be if you were looking at it when it died and can recall what you saw.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
When it becomes a no-start, then we need cranking data posted.

ICP pressure, psig
ICP volts
IPR duty cycle
FICM MPower (main power)
FICM LPower (logic power)
battery voltage
V-reference voltage
rpm

What are you reading codes with?

Have you done a bubble test (fuel bowl check for bubbles when cranking)?

To awnser the questions to the best I can remember
Ficm never drops below 47.5 volts cranking and once it starts it sits between 48v to 48.5
battery load is 13.85 while running
rpm like 850
the others i will have to go back a look at the history on it on the other coolent temp is 190 max and eot is only 194
when it died was when the eot was around 194 if i remember correctly the oil pressure was cold like 612psi and the hot was like 530psi
 

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"resident smarty pants"
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We need cranking data when it won't start all else will be a guess.

The FICM can have issues other than the power voltage, that is why the question on Logic voltage.

Still would like to know what you are using for reading codes. You may have them but your device isn't picking them up.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Have you done an air leak test on the HPO system? That will help pinpoint if there's a leak. I have heard of the IPR being faulty in a few cases when it's so seemingly random, but not always. I would start with the leak test and with doing a search for a hot no start and seeing what everyone else has tried. Sucks to hear and not get a definitive answer, but there are so many potential causes that you'll have to start the process of elimination. One thing which may help is if your scan tool can do recall....can it? Seeing what the numbers look like while it dies would be tremendously helpful. Next best would be if you were looking at it when it died and can recall what you saw.
air leak test was done at the start and the psi was way low the first time and we resealed the injectors oil rail and put now stand tubes and dummy plugs in and also put in a new not remain oem Hpop and then after that the pressure was like 612 to 625. but then the injections would not balance out so i put new ones in. so then since we put them in i said OK fine lets just replace the icp and ipr as well to just put everything in new in case one was bad form the past failure. I also use the auto enginuity ford enhanced tool to work on this truck. the shop is using a high end snap-on unit the shop is getting 2 new gauges to get more true PSI ratings
 

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Discussion Starter #8
We need cranking data when it won't start all else will be a guess.

The FICM can have issues other than the power voltage, that is why the question on Logic voltage.

Still would like to know what you are using for reading codes. You may have them but your device isn't picking them up.
auto enginuity ford enhanced package and I have an sct tuner on it but no tunes dont believe in rolling cole just wanted it for the live gauge part. well the ficm was just rebuilt like 6 months ago or less by a person in Texas called the ficm fixer and its under warranty. an i know it dont mean it cant break again.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
When it becomes a no-start, then we need cranking data posted.

ICP pressure, psig
ICP volts
IPR duty cycle
FICM MPower (main power)
FICM LPower (logic power)
battery voltage
V-reference voltage
rpm

What are you reading codes with?

Have you done a bubble test (fuel bowl check for bubbles when cranking)?

To awnser the questions to the best I can remember
Ficm never drops below 47.5 volts cranking and once it starts it sits between 48v to 48.5
battery load is 13.85 while running
rpm like 850
the others i will have to go back a look at the history on it on the other coolent temp is 190 max and eot is only 194
when it died was when the eot was around 194 if i remember correctly the oil pressure was cold like 612psi and the hot was like 530psi
ficm logic is 12.2v
 

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Have you looked at all your harness and connections? I'm telling you, it is easy to get trained on one thing to diagnose a problem and you miss the forest for the trees. Verify you electrical. Your FICM can read fine but still have an issue.

Once you post the stats it will be easier to diagnose. Torque Pro with a $5 ELM327.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Have you looked at all your harness and connections? I'm telling you, it is easy to get trained on one thing to diagnose a problem and you miss the forest for the trees. Verify you electrical. Your FICM can read fine but still have an issue.

Once you post the stats it will be easier to diagnose. Torque Pro with a $5 ELM327.
most of the info is posted in earlier post
Ficm 47.5v
Ficm 12.2v
Battery 13.85 while running when cranking the battery's still have 14.2
EOT 190-194
Coolant 188-191
Also Im using the Auto Enginuity Ford extended also fallowing with an sct tuner for the gauge parts and have checked and replaced and fixed any bad ground. I have the elm 327 as well lol went with that and the torque pro app first but cant get what i get out of the autoenginuity
furent line had issues with the old injectors not staying balanced replaced with new oem and had low pressure when unit is cold it has 612 psi when hot its has 545
 

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"resident smarty pants"
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According to earlier posts the data you posted is not when you have the no-start.

I don't believe that the batteries are at 14.2V when "cranking but not starting". The 14.2V reflects alternator voltage. If the alternator is not putting out, you won't even have 12.6V at the batteries.

I posted specific data that I was interested in and it doesn't appear to me that you have provided it.

You posted Logic power, but didn't say if it was when cranking during the no-start occurrence.
Your hot ICP of 545 also isn't specified to be during the no-start.

I don't see IPR data, v-reference voltage, or cranking rpm (during no-start).

Not being difficult, but problem solving over the internet requires very specific communication.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
According to earlier posts the data you posted is not when you have the no-start.

I don't believe that the batteries are at 14.2V when "cranking but not starting". The 14.2V reflects alternator voltage. If the alternator is not putting out, you won't even have 12.6V at the batteries.

I posted specific data that I was interested in and it doesn't appear to me that you have provided it.

You posted Logic power, but didn't say if it was when cranking during the no-start occurrence.
Your hot ICP of 545 also isn't specified to be during the no-start.

I don't see IPR data, v-reference voltage, or cranking rpm (during no-start).

Not being difficult, but problem solving over the internet requires very specific communication.
I understand I dont have the Ipr data or v reference voltage or cracking rpm. @ this point I dont have the truck in my hands its at a shop and they are having issues too but i did check the battery @ cranking and @ 11.6v and the logic power is from when it trying to crank when it has the no start and the icp pressure is true value 508psi coming from pressure gauge that has been Td of at the Icp port during the event.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
According to earlier posts the data you posted is not when you have the no-start.

I don't believe that the batteries are at 14.2V when "cranking but not starting". The 14.2V reflects alternator voltage. If the alternator is not putting out, you won't even have 12.6V at the batteries.

I posted specific data that I was interested in and it doesn't appear to me that you have provided it.

You posted Logic power, but didn't say if it was when cranking during the no-start occurrence.
Your hot ICP of 545 also isn't specified to be during the no-start.

I don't see IPR data, v-reference voltage, or cranking rpm (during no-start).

Not being difficult, but problem solving over the internet requires very specific communication.
Ok i hope this has all the info on it it the last pick was right as it died out when I went to crank it back it was reading 300psi an 0 for desired but while it was live streaming i was watching the screen and different sensors would lose sync including my ficm but would come back in like 3 sec since this was started i have replaced the cam sensor seamed to have helped but still not there. now if I unplug the icp and recycle the truck it will default and fire up and fun for like 5 min an shut off plug it back in and it keeps working.
 

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"resident smarty pants"
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Ok i hope this has all the info on it it the last pick was right as it died out when I went to crank it back it was reading 300psi an 0 for desired but while it was live streaming i was watching the screen and different sensors would lose sync including my ficm but would come back in like 3 sec since this was started i have replaced the cam sensor seamed to have helped but still not there. now if I unplug the icp and recycle the truck it will default and fire up and fun for like 5 min an shut off plug it back in and it keeps working.
Earlier you stated you replaced the ICP sensor. Did you use an OEM sensor? Did you inspect the connector and the wiring when you replaced it? Your statement above (in red) indicates an issue there doesn't it??? ALSO - I asked for ICP volts, but didn't see that information ............

The hot ICP values seem low, so a leak may still be there as Weatherlite posted. That said, it doesn't "sound" like that is the main issue w/ it shutting off. I do know that 300 psi won't allow you to start, so that is certainly an issue that needs to be resolved!

Usually an issue w/ it dying is an electrical issue and the IPR valve or wiring and the FICM are two very common culprits.

I gather you repaired the FICM yourself, so that leads me to wonder if you found everything. The logic side can have issues as well. Just a thought.

Your post above "different sensors would lose sync including my ficm but would come back in like 3 sec since this was started" is confusing to me. I don't know what you mean by a sensor losing sync.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
icp volts are .86 v the harness is brand new for the ficm and the engine and as for the ficm being done I sent it to a person called ficm fixer in Texas who fixes and test them it had 4 bad point on the electrical side i had that done when I got a code for it for low voltage. all parts have been replaced with ford oem parts 3 times over same issue
 

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"resident smarty pants"
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Sorry I missed your earlier post on using FICM Fixer. I would assume that he has a way of testing the logic board also (although I don't know that for sure). Maybe call him to verify?

You said the FICM harness was new, how about the ICP wiring? How old is the engine harness (age and miles)? Could the wiring to the ICP sensor already be chafed. From your post, something seems wrong around the ICP.

Same song different verse ............ check for wire chafing around the IPR valve and the CKP sensor wiring around the A/C compressor.

Can you monitor the 5V reference voltage and see if it is unstable?

Lastly - did you ever do a bubble test on the fuel? I didn't see you address that, but if you did I'll apologize in advance. Even though the injectors are new(ish), one could have been torqued improperly or have sealing issues,
 

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Discussion Starter #18
no on the bubble test

but yes I have replaced the ICP sensor and the connection loos good as it is part of the new harness. the harness was put on in may June time line. and when i think about it now the truck did not have this issue till after the new harness was put in. not saying that is it but im beginning to wonder because u normally wont get cam senor code, crank code and glow plug codes all at one time. at this time I was going to get rid of it but i dont want the payment on a new truck and so i left it ant the ford shop to see if they can find it. if they cant find it then we really have a good issue going here. an for the ficm fixer person they test it in a Donner truck and on the bench. getting back to what i was saying I think they shop may have messed up my new harness all i did was take it in to have the egr deleted and then they told me that the harness was bad i kinda knew it was only because my vgt went out i put a new in an well lets just say it crumbled before i could pull it out of the port. but the only issues I had then were a low boost issue got a few bad back pressure sensors learned the hard way (just use oem ) ya figured it out. then i started looking at why did my truck run like crap well did some digging found a code for the ficm low voltage sent it out had it fixed. and when i went to put it back noticed the hold clips were broken. but i let it slide since it was only one clip the truck ran great after that other then the injectors were a sing for being worn out.but it would run an start no issues.
 

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Well the Problem has been found and resolved an bad crank sensor was to blame rusted and faulted out original ring around the to failed and let moisture in and caused it to short out along with the cam sensor I had for put a new one in in each and the truck is back to running like it should the crank sensor was so bad that it took the ford mechanic 2 hrs to get it out better him then me my luck it would have broken of in the block and I would have had to try to tap it out not the easiest place to get to. but I hope this help someone else the crank sensor dont normally throw a code unless they get as bad as min was but if the truck stalls like mine did try that sensor first it only a 50 $ part at ford as i said not the easiest place to get to behind the motor mount and the a/c compressor it only one 8 mm bolt but getting the sensor out is the hard part.
 

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"resident smarty pants"
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FYI - You will almost always lose cranking rpm w/ a bad crank sensor. That is why I asked for it so many times.
 
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