Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws? - PowerStrokeNation : Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
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post #1 of 39 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 04:49 PM Thread Starter
Junior Mint
 
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Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws?

If you are not aware, the change in this law allows anyone, including corporations and Unions to provide literally unlimited campaign donations to the candidate of their choice.

Supreme Court Blocks Ban on Corporate Political Spending - NYTimes.com

This will undoubtedly lead to simple vote buying as the Corporations/ Unions will be in a position to remove anyone from office they desire simply by providing the candidate that supports their view point w/ large amounts of cash to campaign and win elections. It's worth noting here that the budgets that Unions have are but a tiny fraction of what even a mid sized company has to work with but I don't feel that 2 wrongs, make a right either way. I personally don't want undue influence on our politicians from anyone.

In my eyes they just sold our democracy to the highest bidder but I recognize that this might be a distinctly Left point of view (the Liberal judges dissented where-as the Conservative judges ruled for the overturn and won on a 5-4 split vote) so I'm interested in hearing other views on this.

Many parts of the world work this way of course and many people feel it's fair that if you have more money you should simply get more say and get laws that benefit you. Many countries in So. America and Africa actually maintain political systems in this manner and it's considered completely normal and exceptable.

I for one would trade any liberal viewpint (healthcare anyone) for a public finance system for potential politicians to remove $ from the equation.

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post #2 of 39 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 05:06 PM
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Re: Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws?

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Originally Posted by Suns_PSD View Post
If you are not aware, the change in this law allows anyone, including corporations and Unions to provide literally unlimited campaign donations to the candidate of their choice.
That's the way it should be.

If only those who knew what they were talking about replied, this thread would still be on page one.
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post #3 of 39 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 05:18 PM
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Re: Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws?

Voters get to choose who they want, regardless of the candidates income. Anything that government tries to regulate and control is usually FILLED with unintended consequences that creates more problems than it fixes, IMO.

In regards to McCain-Feingold, it was unconstitutional, IMO. The Federal Election Committee was unilaterally deciding who was classified as "media" and who was not and therefore restricting freedom of speech. I.E., unconstitutional. The government does not have the right, nor should they.

JMOs.


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post #4 of 39 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 05:38 PM
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Re: Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suns_PSD View Post
If you are not aware, the change in this law allows anyone, including corporations and Unions to provide literally unlimited campaign donations to the candidate of their choice.

Supreme Court Blocks Ban on Corporate Political Spending - NYTimes.com

This will undoubtedly lead to simple vote buying as the Corporations/ Unions will be in a position to remove anyone from office they desire simply by providing the candidate that supports their view point w/ large amounts of cash to campaign and win elections.
"The majority opinion did not disturb bans on direct contributions to candidates, but the two sides disagreed about whether independent expenditures came close to amounting to the same thing."

It's worth noting here that the budgets that Unions have are but a tiny fraction of what even a mid sized company has to work with but I don't feel that 2 wrongs, make a right either way. I personally don't want undue influence on our politicians from anyone.

In my eyes they just sold our democracy to the highest bidder but I recognize that this might be a distinctly Left point of view (the Liberal judges dissented where-as the Conservative judges ruled for the overturn and won on a 5-4 split vote) so I'm interested in hearing other views on this.


Many parts of the world work this way of course and many people feel it's fair that if you have more money you should simply get more say and get laws that benefit you. Many countries in So. America and Africa actually maintain political systems in this manner and it's considered completely normal and exceptable.
“When government seeks to use its full power, including the criminal law, to command where a person may get his or her information or what distrusted source he or she may not hear, it uses censorship to control thought,” Justice Kennedy wrote. “This is unlawful. The First Amendment confirms the freedom to think for ourselves.”

I for one would trade any liberal viewpint (healthcare anyone) for a public finance system for potential politicians to remove $ from the equation.
The red inserts come directly from the article you referenced in your link.

Nothing stops the news media from expressing their opinions, however biased they may be....either LEFT or RIGHT. So I think that what the SC is saying is that, according to the First Amendment to the Constitution, censoring or banning certain groups, corporations, or whoever from spending money to express their opinion is unlawful.

Now, in my opinion, what this will do is bombard the American people with truths, half-truths, and outright lies in an attempt to further a particular agenda. Not really much different than now.

Another point of consideration. When I hear or read the continual bashing of these "evil" big corporations, I wonder if anyone stops to consider the hundreds of thousands of people they EMPLOY!

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post #5 of 39 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 06:39 PM
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Re: Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws?

There are two trains of thought as I see it.

On one side is the idea of free speech. Anyone should have the right to voice their opinion, whether big or small. If the voice of the big corporate giants and unions can be silenced, then anyone can be silenced.

On the other side of the coin is the idea that politicians and political seats can be bought. The more money you have, the greater influence you have to sway voters one way or another. Media has a huge influence on the voting population. Unfortunately, that media influence has a long history of misrepresenting facts and distorting truth.

In short, there is no simple solution. How do you exercise free speech and curb political corruption and special interest buyouts at the same time?

Let's look forward to 2010. Let's say that a political candidate gets huge donations and advertisements paid for by certain special interest groups. What is that political office's obligation to those groups should that candidate win the election? Obviously (and we have seen this plenty of times in the past) that candidate will cater to those special interest groups that donated large quantities of cash, even if catering to those special interest policies are in fact bad for the country as a whole. If he/she doesn't, they will lose that support come the next round of elections. In short, money can in a way buy a political seat.

On the other hand, what if there is a legitimate issue that needs to be addressed, and is good for the country as a whole? If funding those campaign issues is muted or limited, then it won't gain the exposure needed to get the attention it deserves in Washington. This creates a whole new set of problems where the voice of the American people can be silenced.

So there's the main arguments as I see it. At this point, I don't have an answer. Somehow we have to find an avenue for free speech to flourish, and at the same time eliminate the influence of special interest groups. This will require a systematic overhaul of the entire election process as we know it. Personally, I think it would be easier to shoot a bolt of lightning out of my bung hole than overhaul the election process.

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post #6 of 39 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 07:11 PM
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Re: Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws?

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Originally Posted by Pocket View Post
There are two trains of thought as I see it.

On one side is the idea of free speech. Anyone should have the right to voice their opinion, whether big or small. If the voice of the big corporate giants and unions can be silenced, then anyone can be silenced.

On the other side of the coin is the idea that politicians and political seats can be bought. The more money you have, the greater influence you have to sway voters one way or another. Media has a huge influence on the voting population. Unfortunately, that media influence has a long history of misrepresenting facts and distorting truth.

In short, there is no simple solution. How do you exercise free speech and curb political corruption and special interest buyouts at the same time?

Let's look forward to 2010. Let's say that a political candidate gets huge donations and advertisements paid for by certain special interest groups. What is that political office's obligation to those groups should that candidate win the election? Obviously (and we have seen this plenty of times in the past) that candidate will cater to those special interest groups that donated large quantities of cash, even if catering to those special interest policies are in fact bad for the country as a whole. If he/she doesn't, they will lose that support come the next round of elections. In short, money can in a way buy a political seat.

On the other hand, what if there is a legitimate issue that needs to be addressed, and is good for the country as a whole? If funding those campaign issues is muted or limited, then it won't gain the exposure needed to get the attention it deserves in Washington. This creates a whole new set of problems where the voice of the American people can be silenced.

So there's the main arguments as I see it. At this point, I don't have an answer. Somehow we have to find an avenue for free speech to flourish, and at the same time eliminate the influence of special interest groups. This will require a systematic overhaul of the entire election process as we know it. Personally, I think it would be easier to shoot a bolt of lightning out of my bung hole than overhaul the election process.

The sad fact is that a lot of candidates/elected officials ALREADY cater to special interest, that's a huge part of the problem now. I believe that money equates to power in the way the entire world operates. Any voice from any source simply portrays their own agenda whatever that may be and whether or not it's right or left.....er.... I mean wrong.

The voice that must become loud and strong is the voice of the American people. Then, and only then, will anyone stop to listen.

Again, look at what Justice Kennedy is saying, Powerful words maybe even historic..?
“When government seeks to use its full power, including the criminal law, to command where a person may get his or her information or what distrusted source he or she may not hear, it uses censorship to control thought,” Justice Kennedy wrote. “This is unlawful. The First Amendment confirms the freedom to think for ourselves.”


Curtis, when you figure out the lightning bolt thing, be sure to make a video!

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post #7 of 39 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 07:46 PM
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Re: Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws?

The extreme left is pizzed so it must be the right decision.
If Chucky Schumer hates it, I am in favor of it.

Unions can contribute as much money as they want but the employers can't contribute anything?

George Bush should have never signed this into law to begin with.

Already Barney Frank and Co. are trying to come up with a work around.

The supreme court looks at constitutionality of a law, pass or fail. This one failed. If Congress doesn't like the decision then they need to Amend the constitution.
A Constitutional scholar like President Obama should be applauding the decision.

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post #8 of 39 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 08:15 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws?

I struggle to see how the needs of a private entity are anything at all like "individual free speech" protected by the 1st.

I'm not anti-corporation by any means. At the same time I don't want to see laws passed that hurt the American public, often the disenfranchised, simply because a large corporation has the means to buy votes. And of course this already happens but will only accelerate going forward.

Regardless of your opinion on this issue let's be clear about one thing, this is simply buying votes and nothing more. Yes it already happens but this just increases the influence. If you think Democracy should be for sale to the highest bidder than you will agree w/ this direction in politics.

I sell a few trucks to a very large Mexican construction company and I have seen the effects of this. Basically, the construction company that has family in governement gets all, and I mean ALL of the construction contracts. Then, w/ their money, they simply ensure that their people are always elected which is quite easy w/ mass media and enough money and their interest always come first. In this way, a very few become very rich while everyone else no matter how hard working, smart, and able has no real chance of succeeding or getting ahead. The rich controlling everything, have the ability to control information and keep themselves in power quite easily.

I'm officially...Stroke-less.
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post #9 of 39 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 09:13 PM
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Re: Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws?

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Originally Posted by Suns_PSD View Post
I'm not anti-corporation by any means.
That's good because you work for one. Millions of people work for corporations. Corporations are built by people. I like corporations and rich people, they make good customers.

If only those who knew what they were talking about replied, this thread would still be on page one.
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post #10 of 39 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 09:14 PM
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Re: Any opinions on the Supreme Court's reversal of Campaign finance reform laws?

in polictics its called a donation
everywhere else its called a bride
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