Uninsured In America...By Choice..... - PowerStrokeNation : Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 06:14 AM Thread Starter
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Uninsured In America...By Choice.....

Talk about playing the game to get free health care.....

They would rather party, drink & spend the money on fun activities instead of health care & know they will get free health care if needed....


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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 03:06 PM
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Re: Uninsured In America...By Choice.....

It's funny how that works. Opt out, and you get cheap or free health care.

Opt in, and you pay a fortune for insurance.

As an example, one of our business partners was in town this weekend. His company employs about 50 people, and he has been struggling with health care coverage. His out of pocket expenses for employee health insurance is $500 per person... per month. His employees have to pay out of their pocket around $500 a month (depending on family, existing medical conditions, etc). That's $12,000 (combined company and individual premium costs) per year per employee. He even said a few employees are high risk, paying up to another $500 per month.

Anyone see a problem here?


I do. The problem is the current system and how it's structured. Health care costs are rising much faster than inflation. There are many reasons. One is like the video above... paying for the freeloaders. Another is lack of tort control and reform. Malpractice insurance is through the roof, thanks to uncontrolled and unlimited lawsuites. Lastly, a big problem is lack of competition and free market.

So how does lack of competition fit in? Well, it's due to the health insurance companies. Health insurance takes away the consumer choice. They give you a list of certain doctors that you can see, so you don't research prices, quality, etc yourself. This eliminates the competitive market. With competition gone, prices artificially inflate. Insurance companies, in order to keep up with price inflation, turn around and increase premiums for coverage.

What's an example of price inflation? Well, a friend of mine recently went to the hospital with an injury to her finger. She cut her finger, and fractured one of the bones. She was there for 2 hours in the hospital, got an X-ray and a few stitches. The cost? Over $3,000 for that simple proceedure. Do a few stitches and an X-ray cost that much? No, they don't. In comparison, I've gone to a clinic (not a free community clinic or anything, just a regular one) for an X-ray and stitches. The X-ray cost $50, the stitches were $100. That was it. As you can see, there is a pricing problem. She went through her insurance for her health care. I just went to the closest clinic available because I was gushing blood like crazy... and the hospital was too far away. My expenses I paid out of pocket, without ever calling my insurance company (I had high deductable at the time, so it wouldn't have mattered anyway).

So how do we get health care costs under control? Simple, we fix the broken market. Get malpractice lawsuites under control to bring down doctor's costs of insurance. Second, restructure the entire health care insurance industry. Health savings accounts (HSA's) are a great tool, but need to be changed. Why is it that the government puts such a low cap on how much you can contribute to HSA's each month, but has no cap on how much you spend, how much you take a loan out, etc? Reform HSA's so you and your employer can contribute larger amounts. Restructure health insurance to be a high deductable coverage for major and/or long term health care problems that HSA's can't afford.

If consumers use HSA's, it means they keep the money in hand instead of giving it up to insurance companies. This also means that consumers now have an unlimited choice of doctors, and take personal responsibility for their own healthcare. This means they can shop pricing and quality of care, and the market in turn becomes competitive. Doctors now have to compete with each other to get customers, just like any other industry. In order to attract customers, you have to provide high quality at a reasonable and fair market price.

In the end, health care costs come down to a normal and affordable level. People are more responsible for their own health care choices, meaning they will also more likely take care of themselves better (the U.S. is currently one of the most obese countries in the world). There's a lot of good that can come out of this simply by allowing capitalism to work properly in the health care industry. In the end, it means less, not more, government involvement in day to day health care.

Ok, end of my rant.

Curtis
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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 03:10 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Uninsured In America...By Choice.....

I say we bring the unions in & turn health care over to the unions...

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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 03:18 PM
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Re: Uninsured In America...By Choice.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by RampRat View Post
I say we bring the unions in & turn health care over to the unions...
ROFL!

Curtis
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 03:18 PM
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Re: Uninsured In America...By Choice.....

I say we shoot every other lawyer and kill every two docs.

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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 03:36 PM
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Re: Uninsured In America...By Choice.....

Good post Pocket.

One other thing worth noting is that Physician's are paid by procedures, not making people healthy. So you consistantly see Dr.s requesting too many procedures just because insurance will pay for them. This also offers them much needed protection from lawsuits as it shows they used due diligence when diagnosing an illness.

So many problems w/ the current system.

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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 03:42 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Uninsured In America...By Choice.....

Tell me this.

Who/What country has a better health care system that the one America has...

Easy question is it not

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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 03:44 PM
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Re: Uninsured In America...By Choice.....

Suns will come back with the World health organizations list from 2001. But the thing that the people who come with that list fail to mention. Is shortly after it was published back then. The WHO came out an said the list was largely flawed

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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 04:02 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Uninsured In America...By Choice.....

CMA: Our health care system is imploding


CMA: Our health care system is imploding

Canadians need a plan to cure it

Dean Recksiedler/Lyle Fisher SASKATOON (NEWS1130) 2009-08-16 12:10
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The Canadian Medical Association says we need a plan to protect our healthcare (News1130 Photo)

SASKATOON (NEWS1130) - The incoming president of the Canadian Medical Association says the health-care system is imploding and doctors have to develop a plan to cure it. Dr. Anne Doig says the care being provided to patients right now is less than optimal. She says doctors, who are gathered in Saskatoon for their annual meeting, recognize that changes must be made.

However, Wendy Fucile with the Registered Nurses' Association of Ontario says the CMA has to listen to Canadians. "There are national polls that support the notion of publicly funded health care, commonly what we call Medicare, being a very core value for many Canadians. It is in part one of those key elements that differentiates our country and our ethics from some others."

The pitch for change starts Sunday with a presentation from Dr. Robert Ouellet, the Association's outgoing president. He has called for a patient-centred system and that could mean a role for private health care delivery within the public system.

Meanwhile Dr. Robert Ouellette, the outgoing president of the CMA, says he's worried about where we're headed. The Montreal radiologist says the system could implode if we don't make changes.

Ouellette says wait times are the big worry to both patients and those in the medical communities -- doctors, nurses and therapists. "It is possible to have a universal system without significant wait times. This is the goal we want to achieve in the transformation we want to implement."

He says any talk of moving away from a 100 per cent universal system gets some people thinking we're on our way to a US system. However, he says we must forget the rhetoric and move on so we can make the necessary changes.

Homepage - News1130 - ALL NEWS RADIO

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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 04:03 PM
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Re: Uninsured In America...By Choice.....

If people would try and get well at home and not go to the Gdamn ER for every little thing we might not have this train wreck going on.
This is another place where common sense goes along way . I mean for me to go to a hospital or clinic I gotta be gushing blood. A little neosporen and a few bandaids go along ways ok maybe some nonkey blood good ol macherachrome (sp)

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