Building a early 99 7.3 - PowerStrokeNation : Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
 
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-24-2011, 01:07 PM Thread Starter
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Building a early 99 7.3

I am building a 7.3 early 99, I have fit all the internals, during the check of parts fit I discovered the piston deck height check showed different deck heights, the high was .026 and the low was .016. The max height is .031 so still in spec but is .010 difference something to fix? The block has been fully machined, .030 oversize bore, standard mains and rods, block deck is flat.
The fix if it needs it would be to machine the tops to the same height so it would have the same protrusion.
There is no pattern to the height difference as in one side is higher than the other, it is random, the rods where reconditioned and they are the same length, new piston pin bushings, the pistons are from Ford, they are Mahle.

Thank you.

Jim

1996 OBS Crewcab, Shortbed, 4x4, Automatic Transmission, Baby Swamps, Adrenaline HPOP, SuperDuty Electric Fuel Pump conversion, Quick Turbo Housing, 6 Position Chip, 3" Down Pipe, 2 Disc Locking Converter, Intercooler
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-26-2011, 02:17 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Building a early 99 7.3

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Originally Posted by jake2far View Post
I am building a 7.3 early 99, I have fit all the internals, during the check of parts fit I discovered the piston deck height check showed different deck heights, the high was .026 and the low was .016. The max height is .031 so still in spec but is .010 difference something to fix? The block has been fully machined, .030 oversize bore, standard mains and rods, block deck is flat.
The fix if it needs it would be to machine the tops to the same height so it would have the same protrusion.
There is no pattern to the height difference as in one side is higher than the other, it is random, the rods where reconditioned and they are the same length, new piston pin bushings, the pistons are from Ford, they are Mahle.

Thank you.

Jim

Posted this thinking someone would know and share.


Jim

1996 OBS Crewcab, Shortbed, 4x4, Automatic Transmission, Baby Swamps, Adrenaline HPOP, SuperDuty Electric Fuel Pump conversion, Quick Turbo Housing, 6 Position Chip, 3" Down Pipe, 2 Disc Locking Converter, Intercooler
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-27-2011, 04:03 PM Thread Starter
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Maybe this site should be called "Powerstoke the babe of the day"

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Posted this thinking someone would know and share.


Jim
I have followed this site for awhile, I have purchased Swamps Baby injectors, Swamps 6 position tuner, ARP studs, SS bellowed up pipes, Super Duty Electric fuel system, Gauges, Pod, Adrenalin Injection Pump, new Turbo, turbo pedestal, and a complete engine rebuild kit. Most of these purchases came from site sponsors, I started this project 5 months ago and am in the process of putting the engine together.
My question is, if this site is for help and assistance for the Powerstroke why hasn't anybody provided the information requested? .010 piston height difference will make a compression ratio difference between cylinders, others have had to run into this?
So far the only answer given was a private comment that I should go to another site and ask.
What's up with that?
There are more than 600,000 hits on the babe of the day but no one can address if I need to set the deck height of my pistons to the same dimension? If I need to do this how would I do it? I have a complete machine shop so basically how to grab the piston and how much would need to be removed.

Thanks for your time, I won't ask again.

Jim

1996 OBS Crewcab, Shortbed, 4x4, Automatic Transmission, Baby Swamps, Adrenaline HPOP, SuperDuty Electric Fuel Pump conversion, Quick Turbo Housing, 6 Position Chip, 3" Down Pipe, 2 Disc Locking Converter, Intercooler
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-27-2011, 07:10 PM
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Re: Building a early 99 7.3

could be a bent rod.

did you have the rod (big ends) resized? and new pin bushings installed in the small ends?

did the machine shop (or you) check centerline length from BE to SE on the rods?

you could try a different piston on that same rod, or move that rod/piston assy to another hole...

if the short 'piston' height stays with the rod...I'd replace it.

any history on the engine that you started with? nitrous, propane

previously blown HG perhaps?
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-27-2011, 11:58 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Building a early 99 7.3

Big end has been resized, small end has new bushings, rods are straight. The length of the rods are the same. No history on the engine, I purchased it as a complete engine, I tore it down and am rebuilding it because it was advertised as 254,000 mile engine, I have had the heads rebuilt, the block bored, the mains resized, the block decked, new cam, new bearings and so on. It is piston top to wrist pin that is different.
I have 16 new pistons and they are all over the board, the pistons came from Mahle through Ford in a kit. The reason I have 16 pistons is the first set of rings installed on the pistons in the kit had the wrong end gap, none of the top rings were under .027 which is beyond spec, I called Ford and asked for another set of rings they sent me complete pistons with rings from another kit, the rings are correct but I have about .010 difference in deck height, I tried other pistons from the first 8 and they are the same all over the place, I have high graded to get the best match but have not closed up the gap, I have swapped pistons from rod/hole to hole and they remain the same, if it was .007 taller in hole 1 rod 1 and I moved it to rod/hole 2 the same .007 is there. The best I can come up with is make all of them the same height, CC the piston, check the weight to make them the same, radius the edge of the cavity.
What I would like to know is what is the best way to hold the piston in a lathe so the work can be performed. I have a piece of 5 inch rod aluminum bar stock and was thinkig about fabricating a holding fixture to machine them. I was wondering how others have dealt with machining the tops of the piston?
Thank you for your reply.
Jim

1996 OBS Crewcab, Shortbed, 4x4, Automatic Transmission, Baby Swamps, Adrenaline HPOP, SuperDuty Electric Fuel Pump conversion, Quick Turbo Housing, 6 Position Chip, 3" Down Pipe, 2 Disc Locking Converter, Intercooler
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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-28-2011, 03:36 PM
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Re: Building a early 99 7.3

a 3 jaw chuck on the lathe for the piston decking is fine...but if you wanted to use the lathe to machine out the bowl/radius (rather than do it freehand) you'd need a 4 jaw chuck...since the bowl isn't centered on the piston.

indicate it round first...then indicate on the face...then recheck round...recheck face...

and machine as necessary.

the piston has a slight taper (.004-.005 off the top of my head)...so you may need to take a thin strip of brass stock and wrap it around the smaller OD (up near the ring lands).

measure the OD (to the nearest ten thou) before chucking them up...and double check the OD after machining to make sure you didn't distort them by over tightening them in the 3/4 jaw...been there/done that.

snug is fine...& wear a football helmet

have you checked the part numbers on the pistons?

if they are Mahle 144200WR0x0 (x being 1,2,3, etc referring to 010/020 etc overbore)...then that is a STANDARD height piston

the Mahle 144201WR0x0 is a 010 shorter DECKHEIGHT (and the appropriate 010/020/etc overbore)

it's possible that they mixed & matched some pistons...

the only diff is that the "201" part number is 010 shorter from the piston pin hole to the top of the piston...to allow for block machining w/o having to deck the pistons...

but good for you for CHECKING that chit...
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-31-2011, 07:25 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Building a early 99 7.3

I made a big end bore pin, it is a slip fit, it protrudes 1 1/2 inch beyond the rod, I can check hole parallel by measuring from outside of wrist pin to outside of big end pin on both sides of the rod, twist by laying a flat bar stock across the pins to see if the bar rocks, and bore to side of rod using the lip and a feeler gauge.
I found 2 of 8 twisted, 6 of 8 big end bore not running perpendicular to the rod face, all had a misalignment between center line of pins, the worst .0045 out. It looks like the rods were reconditioned by someone who did not understand how to use the equipment properly.
I posted some pics of the tool I made to check with. Needless to say but they are going back to the shop.

Jim
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1996 OBS Crewcab, Shortbed, 4x4, Automatic Transmission, Baby Swamps, Adrenaline HPOP, SuperDuty Electric Fuel Pump conversion, Quick Turbo Housing, 6 Position Chip, 3" Down Pipe, 2 Disc Locking Converter, Intercooler
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-31-2011, 05:10 PM
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Re: Building a early 99 7.3

...good tools you made...

but I would prefer to find a non bent/twisted set of rods to get re sized properly...unless yuo are certain that the errors are from poor machine work...and not an actual bend/twist in the rods...

not sure what you hp goal is...if anything above stock...but straightening a rod wouldn't be high on my list to do during a rebuild...

I vote for you to find a new set (if they are indeed not straight)..
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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-01-2011, 04:02 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Building a early 99 7.3

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Originally Posted by golfer View Post
...good tools you made...

but I would prefer to find a non bent/twisted set of rods to get re sized properly...unless yuo are certain that the errors are from poor machine work...and not an actual bend/twist in the rods...

not sure what you hp goal is...if anything above stock...but straightening a rod wouldn't be high on my list to do during a rebuild...

I vote for you to find a new set (if they are indeed not straight)..
I don't know what horse power I am trying to get, I am trying to set up my truck to tow anywhere from 5,000-10,000 Lbs.
I have installed a Banks Down Pipe, a Super Duty electric fuel system, Baby Swamps, Your 6 position chip, a straight turbo pedestal, bellowed up pipes, Adrenalin oil pump, regulated fuel system with fuel filter delete, Rebuilt early 99 turbo, ebpv delete, big head waste gate, ARP head studs, a complete rebuild (that is what I am working on now), intercooler, I know there is more but I can't remember right now.

Jim

1996 OBS Crewcab, Shortbed, 4x4, Automatic Transmission, Baby Swamps, Adrenaline HPOP, SuperDuty Electric Fuel Pump conversion, Quick Turbo Housing, 6 Position Chip, 3" Down Pipe, 2 Disc Locking Converter, Intercooler
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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 06-27-2012, 02:27 PM
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Re: Building a early 99 7.3

I know this is old but I was just wondering how the motor came out and how its doing today?


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E99 with some of this and a little of that.
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