Why does Big Oil work - PowerStrokeNation : Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
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post #1 of 144 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 01:30 AM Thread Starter
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Why does Big Oil work

I thought it was time to start a new post regarding big oil and ICP. Based on my application (towing) big oil (3200 psi) has produced tremendous results. I have substantially more low end torque, extended power curve up to 3200 rpm, reduced smoke, 23 HP increase on the dyno and impressive fuel mileage increase. All of this was achieved buy the addition of big oil and DP tuner live tuning. My other mods are just a basic intake and exhaust, with this setup it produced 336 HP on a 80 economy tune.

What I am curious to know is why does big oil work so well if increased ICP is unnecessary or possibly detrimental? What is the reason for the increased performance in all areas?
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post #2 of 144 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 01:56 AM
 
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Re: Why does Big Oil work

Increased ICP isn't necessarily unnecessary or possibly detrimental in all cases. The added oil capacity increases the desired pressure faster to give increased injection pressues and better atimization. This in turn burns more efficiently and results in power and fuel economy savings. Because the ICP is actually maintained at the desired pressure across the power curve is why you see gains across the board.

To high of ICP can blow open the popit valves causing them to more or less "float" and making them somewhat uncontrollable by the PCM. This can cause runability issues as well as bleed off excess pressure droping the availalbe amount of oil to run other injectors.

I'm sure a portion of the gains you saw were from the live tuneing as well as teh big oil so you can't give all the gains you've seen to the big oil itself.
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post #3 of 144 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 02:09 AM
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Re: Why does Big Oil work

If you have A-codes you need ~7 times as much oil as the fuel you plan to inject. The more fuel you plan to inject, the more oil you need.

The oil pump(s) are fixed displacement, meaning they only produce a given oil volume capacity for a given revolution. So you can reach a point where you are asking for more oil volume than you actually have. This is when the pressure drops below what you want to equalize the discrepency between desired volume and available volume flow.

Increasing the displacement of the high pressure system give you the opportunity to support more fuel flow while maintaining any given pressure. Or you can run the same fuel flow at a higher pressure. (Fuel flow is directly proportionate to oilflow, dictated by the hydraulic ratio of the injector)

"increased" ICP is not an issue. Only in certain instances can "Extreme" ICP cause detrimental effects, and only if you rework the injectors so that they actually use that ICP, not dump it into the valvecovers through the oil ejection spouts.
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post #4 of 144 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 02:37 AM
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Re: Why does Big Oil work

So what about us guys running your basic 530 hybrid. Would we see the same benifits from big oil? Would a little higher ICP help since our plunger ratio is lower?

2000,CC,4x4,auto
some bolt on stuff from Bean & BTS
Some used and some home made stuff
463hp/991tq 10/01/05 mustang dyno 10k rollers
458hp/923tq 04/14/07 dynojet dyno
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03/08/08 1st runs ever, 13.5 & 13.264 @ 100.65mph screwing up both launches, 7600#'s, #2 only
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post #5 of 144 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 02:51 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Why does Big Oil work

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Originally Posted by hotwheels View Post

I'm sure a portion of the gains you saw were from the live tuning as well as the big oil so you can't give all the gains you've seen to the big oil itself.
The majority of the live tuning was for transmission shifting preference and the change to Jody's big oil program. I had asked if more fuel was added for the big oil program and I was told no there was not. However, yes you are correct Geoff live tuning does make a difference.
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post #6 of 144 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 02:55 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Why does Big Oil work

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Originally Posted by cota View Post
So what about us guys running your basic 530 hybrid. Would we see the same benifits from big oil? Would a little higher ICP help since our plunger ratio is lower?
In addition to your question would it not be beneficial to be able to build higher ICP sooner at a lower RPM regardless of injector type?
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post #7 of 144 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 03:09 AM
 
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Re: Why does Big Oil work

Cota, Yes you would see some gains. Though they would be no where near what you would see on a set of injectors that actually needed it. I would say if you plan to go to B codes down the road then it would be worth while enough to get the big oil. If you just plan on running the hybrids for ever then I wouldn't spend the money.

JMS yes it would be beneficial however there is a point that the benefit isn't worth the cost. IMHO hybrids with a good stock pump work just fine. Going to a big oil system will net some gains but not worth the cost.
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post #8 of 144 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 03:12 AM
 
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Re: Why does Big Oil work

If big oil is not worth the cost then why do you run big oil on your truck Geoff? JMS1 isnt' running hybrids and he saw excellent gains from a big oil system. I saw gains with AD's as well, the money on big oil was worth every cent.
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post #9 of 144 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 03:20 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Why does Big Oil work

I am not sure if I had a weak pump but my ICP would drop to 2100psi at WOT with an 80 economy tune. I would consider the pump almost new being that the truck has 22K.
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post #10 of 144 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 03:26 AM
 
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Re: Why does Big Oil work

69w maybe because I have a set of B codes lined up to go in. And I had planned that since before I got my big oil. Seems to fall in line with what I said above now doesn't it.

I had a stock pump out of a '00 in my truck before the big oil with the same injectors as I have now. I would set a CEL with them with my 10K mod in but as I recall I didn't without it. Not saying that ICP was optimal but and I did see gains going to the big oil and no longer get an ICP code or CEL. If I were going to build my own system and be able to do it for $500-$600 I would say it would be a good thing to get or maybe even buy a DIY kit for $1000-$1100 but no way $2K worth of improvments IMHO.
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