Buyer beware... - PowerStrokeNation : Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2015, 03:24 PM Thread Starter
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Angry Buyer beware...

We've all seen an heard stories of diesel experts and even "6.0 experts" touting the ability to unlock all of the mystical properties of the storied 6.0L, solve it's issues and make it reliable. No question, there are some legitimate operations out there, many are supporting sponsors here.

Some...well, are not so legitimate and it appears that I found one. I am not going to reveal the name of the operation in question as we haven't even begun on a resolution and I fear legal action will soon prevail as I have neither the time nor the patience to spar with these folks. Let's just say they are a Dallas area shop with a reasonably well built website and a great story. It seems thats were it both starts and ends.

No need for a long explanation and you don't care, but here's a bullet pointed (not proofed) list of ailments on a truck I bought that supposedly had the heads removed and inspected, EGR delete done, some aftermarket goodies...and a few things that were supposed to be done that weren't, but that's not salient to the operation of a 6.0 or this post;
  1. Filthy degas bottle..full of sludge
  2. three bad brake rotors
  3. Escaping coolant (still chasing, haven't ruled out bad HG's)
  4. EOT/ECT delta's approaching 15 degrees
  5. A/C inoperable
  6. "WIX" brand oil filter and cap (experts use WIX?) Regardless, oil was dirty and old...no oil change after head removal? Sure...
  7. Leaking main seal
  8. Badly worn ball joints
  9. Insistence that Ford Gold is the best coolant (get's half a pass on this one as some feel this is good stuff...who knows whats really in there though...WIX oil filters anyone?

Point is this: there are places out there selling products and services that aren't what they appear. I bought the sizzle...let's hope there's some steak in this thing.

If you're shopping for a truck, I still maintain that a well done 6.0 can serve you well. DO YOUR HOME WORK and know what you're looking at. Some of the easy stuff can be ID'd at a glance, like the oil filter and the degas bottle. Ask lots of questions and find references from places like...well...

Beware...
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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2015, 04:07 PM
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Re: Buyer beware...

Few things
6.0 oil looks dirty after you start it from a fresh oil change IMO

Wix is stupid but not criminal

Gold = you can't fault the gold mentality

rotors and the BJ's = not sure how your vehicle was represented ?

the sludge is bad news and would correlate to the rising deltas IMO

main seals = they all seem to drip at what point do you spend the couple of grand to fix ?

A/C = maybe an oversight do you ask for a resolution ?

find the coolant leak ;-) then decide if it's a big deal or a loose clamp


good luck I can feel your frustration coming through the postings but have you had any interaction with them ??

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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2015, 04:46 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Buyer beware...

Only electronically...headed back for a look. The launch for the frustration came from the claim that the cab was removed, the heads were cleaned and inspected and then the truck was studded. The heads still have the same west Texas dirt that's found on the firewall and the wiring harness...and the studs and nuts are dirty, not clean like you'd expect from an engine that's been freshly apart...we added exhaust, intake and SCT, but why wouldn't we do brakes and ball joints first?

Just doesn't add up from a place that bills themselves as doing more bullet proof packages than anyone in the country...

I do appreciate your level headed response...and I need to continue to keep mine! :-)
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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2015, 04:57 PM
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Re: Buyer beware...

sucks man, i've had shoddy work done, but never bought a mess of a truck with claims like that! i take it there was mileage put on most of the upgrades, as seen by the dust on the studs, etc? i bet if you asked them the mileage on each of the services & selling points, they'd have to cough up something that would make sense of the mess that you see under the hood. maybe that was their hot-shot rig?


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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2015, 06:53 PM
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Re: Buyer beware...

i agree with Zmann completely . those are strikes against although not a strikeout. I would just go in , have a conversation with them and explain yourself. if they seem to be a reputable shop they will either help fix your situation or they will yield information that can cure some of your questions and woes.


IMHO the only real issues sound like the oil and sludge in the degas bottle . oil cooler is about 300. oil ? well yeah 6ohs eat oil , they don't keep clean for long. try and find out what oil was used in the truck too

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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2015, 07:57 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Buyer beware...

Quote:
Originally Posted by IIvonnyII View Post
i agree with Zmann completely . those are strikes against although not a strikeout. I would just go in , have a conversation with them and explain yourself. if they seem to be a reputable shop they will either help fix your situation or they will yield information that can cure some of your questions and woes.


IMHO the only real issues sound like the oil and sludge in the degas bottle . oil cooler is about 300. oil ? well yeah 6ohs eat oil , they don't keep clean for long. try and find out what oil was used in the truck too
More good input, and thanks. I agree that these are strikes and not an out.

But this doesn't appear to be a head that's just been fluxed an inspected...at least not to me...I talked to the owner while he was supposed dropping these heads off three weeks ago...

[IMG][/IMG]

And this surely doesn't look like a cab bolt that's manipulated in the last month;

[IMG][/IMG]

And if I just installed a new oil cooler, I bet I wouldn't install this bottle back in the truck...

[IMG][/IMG]

This is what drives me nuts..because it doesn't appears I've been lied to. You can lie to me all day long...I'm a grown up. Don't lie to me, insult my intelligence and take my money.

But if I'm wrong, I'm absolutely big enough to admit I'm way off base and apologize...but I don't think I am on this one.

Thanks again for letting me share AND for helping me through this!!!!
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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2015, 08:08 PM
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Re: Buyer beware...

cab doesn't have to have to come off to do heads

motor can come out the front or even possible with motor in

degas bottles do discolor and not normally replaced but does it have sludge or just a deposit on the bottle ?

the heads don't look like they have been off recently do you have some pics of the headbolts ?

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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2015, 08:18 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Buyer beware...

I do have picks of the head bolts Zmann and it's definitely studded...just doesn't appear to be 2 weeks ago. Fasteners are dirty and not clean like they are right after a job like this is completed...

The shop told me it was a cab off...that they do it 3-4 hours...

Definately sludge in that bottle.

I DID see the intake off of THIS TRUCK. Which struck me as odd later...why do that if you're going to do the heads and stud it?

My guess is this; they got this truck at auction. The VIN pops up on some "salvage" sales sites, so it may have been traded in with an issue and dumped on the salvage circuit. Diagnosed with a blown oil cooler, but the truck was studded and deleted already.

They replaced the oil cooler, probably didn't flush it which is why the delta's are where they are, and sold it to me as if it's all been done.

That's my guess anyway. I paid for a stud job that had already been done. That's part of why I'm so concerned that HG's may be bad; who knows what was used?

Head studs...look like they've been there...but again, I could be wrong...

[IMG][/IMG]

And the bottle...sludge...

[IMG][/IMG]
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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2015, 08:43 PM
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Re: Buyer beware...

Agreed it does look like it's been there untouched for a while and that is sediment on your finger
not sure I would go to sludge as the descriptive unless it is worse than that pic ?
but definitely not what i would expect in fresh job

I would start some emails with the seller

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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2015, 08:52 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Buyer beware...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zmann View Post
Agreed it does look like it's been there untouched for a while and that is sediment on your finger
not sure I would go to sludge as the descriptive unless it is worse than that pic ?
but definitely not what i would expect in fresh job

I would start some emails with the seller
The stuff in the bottle is oily...but honestly, I've never been around diesels so I don't know what's normal and what isn't...nevertheless, I replaced the bottle AND added a coolant filter.

Really...I'm not sure what to do. I could ask to have the deal unwound, but it's way down the road for that. The truck was misrepresented as was the work that was supposedly done. I'm prepared to pull a pin on a grenade, but I'm not sure which one or where it needs to be tossed if that makes sense...if studded correctly and the HG's aren't blown...clearly it HAS BEEN done and deleted...it appears that I'm looking at an oil cooler issue...perhaps.

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