After years of delays, I'm just finishing up a 2005 Cummins 5.9 HPCR and Allison 1000 (5 speed) transplant into my 2000 Ford Excursion 4x4 that had one too many blown up 7.3 Powerstroke engines in it by 117,000 miles. Here's the bottom line: Would I do another conversion? Yes- conditionally: with my 20/20 hind sight: I would ONLY buy a complete a roll-over and transplant EVERYTHING I needed out of that. I mean literally the ENTIRE vehicle, not just a "complete engine package with the computer." Piecemeal effort is FAR too expensive and more aggravating than anyone deserves.
Here are the gory details of 3.5 years and countless thousands of wasted dollars:
The problems and expenses encountered FAR exceeded the savings I got by buying a "quick deal" on a "dyno-test engine with only a couple pulls on it." Getting a rear gear case engine with a SAE#3 housing to save the expense of an adapter to run a 4R100 has been disastrously expensive and logistically a total PITA.
Now the fly-by-wire throttle pedal has become an expensive nightmare- I just discovered the one I bought at a wrecking yard 3 years ago for $100 is totally dead. A new one is around $500 and there are 36 of them on back order at the local dodge dealer. Finding something that will work will consume my entire day today.
My "almost new" dyno engine had been dyno'ed to death: the rings were worn out, consequently it didn't have enough compression to start. Complete rebuild after I had everything completely installed.
Then I found that the injectors leaked so badly where the fuel feed tube fits into them that it wouldn't start despite $300 in new fuel feed tubes. That's a common problem. So I just bought ($365 each) the last 6 available re-manufactured injectors in the universe. There aren't any other new or remans available from Bosch for the next SEVEN MONTHS. It seems they screwed up on their "just in time" anticipation of market demand, meaning their injectors WEAR OUT MUCH sooner than anticipated.
BTW, I had new Dynomite Diesel Performance injector tips put on the injectors that came with the engine. Bosch has since changed the injectors so the $1,000 I spent on those tips is now totally wasted because I can't send the cores back without tips and I don't have any old ones. So much for selling the DDP tips on e-bay.
The $1,100 (remanufactured) computer was missing when I bought the engine, and because it's a Freightliner configuration with a rear gear train, I couldn't get a dodge computer to understand when to fire the injectors (cam and crank position sensors are in a different location than Dodge Cummins).
The $1,800 wiring harness I cobbled up to fit the incorrect Dodge ECM I'd bought had to be replaced to convert back to Freightliner- That's just for just the ENGINE harness, PLUS the "OEM" side harness had to be completely de-pinned, rerouted and modified. Had to build my own de-pinning tool from brass tubing.
There's the exhaust system mods, custom intake tubes requiring welding and installation of a bung for a sensor that have been a PITA.
The alternator bracket had the stub-out for the lower radiator hose in the wrong place and that bracket was something like $300.
The crankshaft has 6 bolts in the harmonic balancer end instead of 4 like a dodge, so no aftermarket balancer is available.
The cast aluminum Allison output shaft housing is NOT up to holding up the enormous transfer case found on a Superduty so I had to buy a billet hog-out from Suncoast. I believe they are now getting $1,400 for that piece. The Precision Industries billet converter was around $1,400.
The Allison computer (which will NOT talk to the Dodge or Freightliner ECM) requires reluctor wheel on the output shaft, which meant sending my transfer case out for a modified exchange unit for $1,000.
Drive shaft length mods, custom engine mounts that didn't fit, custom tranny mount, custom regulated/modified fuel system, endless ECM codes from the ECM because I switched to a waste gated turbo and no EGR because the VGT turbo system made the engine 3/4" too wide to fit in the truck...because I insisted on having an air compressor mounted on the opposite (driver's) side...which required notching the firewall back and there was nothing left to cut without moving the steering rod.
SAE #3 housing had to be chopped on a bit too, and the tranny hump and part of the passenger side floor had to be totally redesigned, fabricated and installed. God only knows if I'll ever be able to run a heater duct to the driver's side under the dash, and there will now be NO back seat heat.
The missing fan and hub have cost me around $500 by the time I've gotten everything modified to fit correctly, and now the Freightliner ECM isn't interested in the Dodge electronic hub control.
The custom big-truck power steering pump doesn't seem to be working now that I've gotten the engine started.
New alternator, new big truck starter, new AC pump, new custom AC lines, funky cut and paste radiator hoses and steel tubes, MAYBE the heater will work, had to buy and modify a floor shifter for the tranny. Had to buy an oil filter relocation kit from Destroked. Had to have new battery cables and boxes fabbed.
I now have ATS intake and exhaust manifolds that negate me ever taking the truck into Cummins for any diagnostics due to their EPA oversight.
Had to fab custom intercooler piping and special order aftermarket boots.
The Smarty I bought for the Dodge computer isn't going to work on the Freightliner computer.
Don't even THINK about building a custom fuel line for the HPCR when the twin CP3 line won't fit because of he intake heater- That tube has to hold up to 28,000 PSI. Good luck finding tubing that can hold that pressure. Just cut a junk one in half to get an idea of how thick that tubing wall thickness is- yet it flexes and breaks from the pressure spikes in the common rail.
Then there was the head porting and polishing and the custom cam shaft expenses that will never provide enough cooling and power to justify their costs. Etc, etc, yadda yadda yadda.
Don't take all of that as endless bitching- instead, take it as a reality check BEFORE you tear your truck apart. Follow the "K.I.S.S." method for the entire program which you need to map out ahead of time and thoroughly research before snipping even one wire or loosening one bolt. There is NO such thing as a "Cummins to Dodge" cross reference sheet, so don't assume you can get equivalent parts at each dealership. Example- On the intake plenum plate, Freightliner has two sensors: temperature and pressure. Dodge combined them and uses a different plate. I now own BOTH setups and those sensors are NOT cheap. Be certain of what will fit ahead of time, don't make ANY assumptions about "modifying" a Cummins- they do everything by engine serial number, vs Dodge and Freightliner do everything by VIN. Get the complete ECM wiring schematic from Cummins. Buy,beg or borrow access to Cummins Quickserve through someone at Cummins with high level access. Most importantly, understand clearly that this is not a two-weekend job. I've spent 3.5 YEARS on this project adding up to MONTHS of free time and vacations wasted. Had I known what I know now, I would have gone about this completely differently- which would have saved me at least $10,000 and countless months of wasted time.
If you're worried about a 4R100 holding up, get a BTS. I could have cried when I sold mine- just so I could get one extra gear in an Allison. That was a VERY STUPID, VERY EXPENSIVE decision.
Lastly, Destroked is spendy but worth it. Shop there first.
clam out
Here are the gory details of 3.5 years and countless thousands of wasted dollars:
The problems and expenses encountered FAR exceeded the savings I got by buying a "quick deal" on a "dyno-test engine with only a couple pulls on it." Getting a rear gear case engine with a SAE#3 housing to save the expense of an adapter to run a 4R100 has been disastrously expensive and logistically a total PITA.
Now the fly-by-wire throttle pedal has become an expensive nightmare- I just discovered the one I bought at a wrecking yard 3 years ago for $100 is totally dead. A new one is around $500 and there are 36 of them on back order at the local dodge dealer. Finding something that will work will consume my entire day today.
My "almost new" dyno engine had been dyno'ed to death: the rings were worn out, consequently it didn't have enough compression to start. Complete rebuild after I had everything completely installed.
Then I found that the injectors leaked so badly where the fuel feed tube fits into them that it wouldn't start despite $300 in new fuel feed tubes. That's a common problem. So I just bought ($365 each) the last 6 available re-manufactured injectors in the universe. There aren't any other new or remans available from Bosch for the next SEVEN MONTHS. It seems they screwed up on their "just in time" anticipation of market demand, meaning their injectors WEAR OUT MUCH sooner than anticipated.
BTW, I had new Dynomite Diesel Performance injector tips put on the injectors that came with the engine. Bosch has since changed the injectors so the $1,000 I spent on those tips is now totally wasted because I can't send the cores back without tips and I don't have any old ones. So much for selling the DDP tips on e-bay.
The $1,100 (remanufactured) computer was missing when I bought the engine, and because it's a Freightliner configuration with a rear gear train, I couldn't get a dodge computer to understand when to fire the injectors (cam and crank position sensors are in a different location than Dodge Cummins).
The $1,800 wiring harness I cobbled up to fit the incorrect Dodge ECM I'd bought had to be replaced to convert back to Freightliner- That's just for just the ENGINE harness, PLUS the "OEM" side harness had to be completely de-pinned, rerouted and modified. Had to build my own de-pinning tool from brass tubing.
There's the exhaust system mods, custom intake tubes requiring welding and installation of a bung for a sensor that have been a PITA.
The alternator bracket had the stub-out for the lower radiator hose in the wrong place and that bracket was something like $300.
The crankshaft has 6 bolts in the harmonic balancer end instead of 4 like a dodge, so no aftermarket balancer is available.
The cast aluminum Allison output shaft housing is NOT up to holding up the enormous transfer case found on a Superduty so I had to buy a billet hog-out from Suncoast. I believe they are now getting $1,400 for that piece. The Precision Industries billet converter was around $1,400.
The Allison computer (which will NOT talk to the Dodge or Freightliner ECM) requires reluctor wheel on the output shaft, which meant sending my transfer case out for a modified exchange unit for $1,000.
Drive shaft length mods, custom engine mounts that didn't fit, custom tranny mount, custom regulated/modified fuel system, endless ECM codes from the ECM because I switched to a waste gated turbo and no EGR because the VGT turbo system made the engine 3/4" too wide to fit in the truck...because I insisted on having an air compressor mounted on the opposite (driver's) side...which required notching the firewall back and there was nothing left to cut without moving the steering rod.
SAE #3 housing had to be chopped on a bit too, and the tranny hump and part of the passenger side floor had to be totally redesigned, fabricated and installed. God only knows if I'll ever be able to run a heater duct to the driver's side under the dash, and there will now be NO back seat heat.
The missing fan and hub have cost me around $500 by the time I've gotten everything modified to fit correctly, and now the Freightliner ECM isn't interested in the Dodge electronic hub control.
The custom big-truck power steering pump doesn't seem to be working now that I've gotten the engine started.
New alternator, new big truck starter, new AC pump, new custom AC lines, funky cut and paste radiator hoses and steel tubes, MAYBE the heater will work, had to buy and modify a floor shifter for the tranny. Had to buy an oil filter relocation kit from Destroked. Had to have new battery cables and boxes fabbed.
I now have ATS intake and exhaust manifolds that negate me ever taking the truck into Cummins for any diagnostics due to their EPA oversight.
Had to fab custom intercooler piping and special order aftermarket boots.
The Smarty I bought for the Dodge computer isn't going to work on the Freightliner computer.
Don't even THINK about building a custom fuel line for the HPCR when the twin CP3 line won't fit because of he intake heater- That tube has to hold up to 28,000 PSI. Good luck finding tubing that can hold that pressure. Just cut a junk one in half to get an idea of how thick that tubing wall thickness is- yet it flexes and breaks from the pressure spikes in the common rail.
Then there was the head porting and polishing and the custom cam shaft expenses that will never provide enough cooling and power to justify their costs. Etc, etc, yadda yadda yadda.
Don't take all of that as endless bitching- instead, take it as a reality check BEFORE you tear your truck apart. Follow the "K.I.S.S." method for the entire program which you need to map out ahead of time and thoroughly research before snipping even one wire or loosening one bolt. There is NO such thing as a "Cummins to Dodge" cross reference sheet, so don't assume you can get equivalent parts at each dealership. Example- On the intake plenum plate, Freightliner has two sensors: temperature and pressure. Dodge combined them and uses a different plate. I now own BOTH setups and those sensors are NOT cheap. Be certain of what will fit ahead of time, don't make ANY assumptions about "modifying" a Cummins- they do everything by engine serial number, vs Dodge and Freightliner do everything by VIN. Get the complete ECM wiring schematic from Cummins. Buy,beg or borrow access to Cummins Quickserve through someone at Cummins with high level access. Most importantly, understand clearly that this is not a two-weekend job. I've spent 3.5 YEARS on this project adding up to MONTHS of free time and vacations wasted. Had I known what I know now, I would have gone about this completely differently- which would have saved me at least $10,000 and countless months of wasted time.
If you're worried about a 4R100 holding up, get a BTS. I could have cried when I sold mine- just so I could get one extra gear in an Allison. That was a VERY STUPID, VERY EXPENSIVE decision.
Lastly, Destroked is spendy but worth it. Shop there first.
clam out