Ford Power Stroke Nation banner

CARB/EPA warning.

14K views 82 replies 39 participants last post by  bwillis2003 
#1 ·
Since this pertains to the 6.4L PSD...

Dear SEMA Member:

We have recently learned that CARB and EPA are planning significant enforcement action against companies that make, distribute or install tuning products for late-model (2007 MY and newer) diesel trucks that are equipped with diesel particulate filters (DPF) if such tuning products offer any of the following features: (1) the ability to re-tune/re-program the truck to operate while the DPF is removed; (2) the ability to turn off urea (exhaust fluid) injection; and/or (3) the ability to defeat, disable or turn off any other required emissions control system on a late-model diesel truck. Products with these features cannot be legally sold for on-highway usage. If you make, sell or install products with these features and they are sold strictly for legal racing use you must be able to make assurances to these regulatory agencies that these products are NOT being used on the street on registered vehicles. If you cannot make those assurances we encourage you to carefully consider your business practices so as to avoid possible penalties.

SEMA is very interested in protecting you and your future and we hope you’ll find this information valuable. If you have any questions please contact Jim McFarland, Consultant for SEMA, regarding compliance with these regulatory agencies.

Sincerely


John Russell Deane, III
SEMA General Counsel
 
See less See more
#3 ·
Apparently, you're under the mistaken impression that ye olde "Off Road Disclaimer" will keep the EPA and CARB wolves at bay. You may wish to reconsider. Please pay particular attention to the lines...

If you make, sell or install products with these features and they are sold strictly for legal racing use you must be able to make assurances to these regulatory agencies that these products are NOT being used on the street on registered vehicles. If you cannot make those assurances we encourage you to carefully consider your business practices so as to avoid possible penalties.
It's not any different then selling a firearm to a person that you know will be using it to commit a felony. All the paperwork in the world doesn't excuse you from the responsibility/liability.

They do not care that your customers have signed a disclaimer. If you sell an emissions defeat device on a truck that is REGISTERED for street use, then they will come after you. PERIOD. If you chose to play the game with CARB and the EPA, be prepared to have your wallets lightened.

What are the penalties for noncompliance?
Penalties for violation of stationary source requirements, fuels requirements, or most motor vehicle emission requirements (by a company or dealer) may be up to $27,500 per violation (per day or per motor vehicle/ engine). Violations of the tampering requirements (by a person other than a company or dealer), or defeat device provisions by anyone may incur penalties of up to $2,750 per vehicle or engine.
This means that CARB/EPA can (and will) go after not only manufacturers, but also individuals... although the word so far is that they are targeting manufacturers.

The choice is yours, but don't act surprised if they come knocking on your door.
 
#5 ·
Jeff... Agree BIG Bogus, I will use the gun dealer statement, a gun dealer requires you to submit paper work for the gun,(weapons permit qualifies) gives you the gun and out the door you go and I will tell you as I have many that no gun dealer keeps track of me and what I do with them after I leave with them. Now I have heard EVERYTHING!!!
 
#7 ·
How is this manufacturer specific? I didn't see any names in the letter from SEMA. (Unlike the ATS letter posted a couple years back which pointed fingers are everyone.) It was a letter to all companies that manufacture emissions defeat devices. So you're saying I shouldn't post this because I shouldn't care if the EPA and CARB are planning to attack an industry that I work in? Well excuse the crap out of me. Maybe I'll just sit back and watch the competition go broke fighting the EPA and losing. Does that sound like a plan to you? :doh: C'mon....

SEMA - The association that covers ALL things aftermarket and has worked closely with auto manufacturers and the government is offering a warning to the industry that the EPA has the firm intent of going after manufacturers of emissions defeat devices. We are supposed to ignore them? Fine... y'all go ahead and do what you like. I'm for sure not going to bet my livelihood on it.

We've seen what the EPA is capable of:

Casper's Electronics, Inc. | Civil Enforcement | Compliance and Enforcement | US EPA

They now have precedence on their side. It's not the fines that hurt (well, they do)... It's the mandatory Buyback of every device you've ever sold.

CBENN....

I used the firearm argument as a comparison, but only in a distant sense. The fact is that the majority of firearms are NOT used in the commission of crimes but are owned by responsible individuals who wield them within the limits of the law. Firearm estimates vary from 200 Million to over 350 Million. In 2006 there were about 400,000 crimes involving firearms which is about 0.2% of the total number of firearms (assuming only 200 Million), and assuming a separate firearm was involved in each crime. This would mean that 99.8% of the firearms are not being used illegally.

Now, lets look at the DPF issue. There is enough tangible evidence to show that even though customers are signing disclaimers that they will not use an emissions defeat device on a registered vehicle on the highway, they are in fact doing so. Even if the vehicle was intended to be used only in off-road or racing applications, the presence of a registration and tag for the vehicle would automatically violate the terms of the disclaimer since the vehicle is supposed to not be registered. With social network sites (forums, Facebook, YouTube, etc.) replete with posts, comments, and videos from owners talking about prospective mileage gains, exhibiting performance comparisons, "smoking" the competition, etc. while using specific devices on vehicles that are clearly registered and driven on the highway, and the fact that most of the manufacturers of these devices use the same social media to advertise and support their products, the manufacturers simply cannot claim ignorance of the usage of their products and expect to be let off the hook.

As I've said, it's not my warning. It's SEMA's. If you don't like it, call them.
 
#10 ·
Casper is old news. Did they even offer up a disclaimer for their customers to sign? From what I read, there is no mention of this. My guess is that lawyers for big companies that offer emissions disabling equipment know enough about Casper to understand how the company they represent should go about their business. It's been over 4 years since that incident occurred. Have any other big companies been fine by the EPA since? I haven't heard of it happening in the diesel industry. DPF deletes have been on the market for 4 years now.
 
#11 ·
Here's the concern...

Yeah, Casper's is old news, but it's a valid precedent. O2 sensor eliminators have been on the market for who knows how long and Casper's was manufacturing them since 2001 (according to the EPA documents). So for whatever reason, the EPA went after them in 2006/2007, smacked them hard, and shut them down. It really looks like it could be the same thing with the DPF kits. Just because they've been around for 4 years doesn't mean that they'll just let that stuff slide. The question now is even if there was no way the EPA could win, they could still put companies into a costly legal battle where the legal fees alone could bankrupt a company. Billion dollar companies don't even want to get entangled with the EPA. It usually doesn't end pretty.
 
#13 ·
I agree with you completely. Before it was just a simple waiver and you could be let off the hook but it seems and though they are even trying to shut that down as well. I don't think it's a small issue. This could potentially effect many small and large businesses in this industry. Our economy is bad enough without the EPA trying to basically shut down these small businesses. And as you said previously, SEMA used to be one of the largest promoters of this aftermarket world and it seems as though they are shutting the door on us. It honestly kinda scares me that things may go to that. I will say this, they can kiss my a$$ because I sure as hell won't drive a truck that gets 11 mpg avg. I don't see that diesels are any worse than any other of the weekend racers who drive their cars daily. Considering that we may only make up probably about 10% of the racing market.

Just my .02
 
#16 ·
Before anyone else starts flaming, one thing I do want to point out is that I am not trying to defend the EPA and I am most certainly not in favor of the EPA coming down on anyone. I agree that the DPF system is the biggest piece of useless garbage force-fed on the automotive community. Worse than catalytic converters and EGR, which at least didn't require tons of wasted fuel to function. I am simply trying to make everyone aware of what is coming down the road. It's not my choice and I certainly am not in any position to be policing anyone. If/when the EPA does come after someone, you can bet it's not going to be a slap on the wrist. They are going to come down hard and make an example of the first companies they come after. Lawsuits amounting in the millions of dollars are quite feasible (after penalties, buybacks, and whatever else they come up with) so that even the possibility of legal action from the EPA or CARB is something everyone should seriously consider.

SEMA, as a representative of the automotive aftermarket, is offering a warning. It's a warning that shouldn't be taken lightly.
 
#18 ·
Looks like its time for someone to make a kit to drop a 6.4 or 6.7 in a 99 to 03 SD :)
 
#21 ·
Man I hope Obama gets out and the new President comes down hard on the EPA. This is such bs.
 
#23 ·
This will be like all the other epa/carb threats and will never come to fruition. They threaten in hopes of causing change to keep them from actually having to do anything. When they realize the problem (so they think) is far less important than saving some toad or strip of land somewhere they move on to something else and then come back around to issues and threaten again. Simple cycle that never ends..
 
#27 ·
I know some will disagree. But until the EPA starts paying my monthly truck payment or diesel drops way down i'll do whatever I want to my truck. True story on my way back home on I40 from Az to Nm a few weeks ago. I went to pass a big rig and got into the go fast pedal a little and blew a light smoke haze then as I come around the big rig there is a AZ dps cop sitting there off the shoulder. So he pull's me over and asked about the dpf being removed and I told the cop yeah it's not going back on unless diesel drops to about 1.50 a gallon he cracked a slight grin and said yeah no kidding, but the reason I pulled you over was to ask how hard it is to delete one and what tuner are you using and oh btw the speed limit is 75 not 106 just slow down a little. Yes sir!
 
#31 ·
As long as they are sold with the intent of off road use only there is nothing they can do, all of the tuners even say that they are for off road use only before you load a tune. Its just smoke and mirrors from some tree hugging blow hards in suits.

Now if you really wanted to screw with them you would just swap the a newer DPF equipped engine into a older model truck and strip the emissions crap off and it would be perfectly legal but its more work than its worth.

Either way its perfectly legal to sell if sold for offroad use only, if the the end user chooses to use it on the road how can you hold the manufacturer or retailer responsible for it?
 
#32 ·
Thanks Eric for saying that, couldn't of said it any better, I think that the most that will come out of this with the EPA would be a yearly requirement by states to inspect 08's up for compliance of emmision controls, visuals, which you, me and most folks know takes less than 2 hours to put back to stock on our trucks, now on the bad side folks that are deleting EGR/coolers on the truck it will be a pain in the arse to reinstall and that is why next week when I do my HG's I will install aftermarket coolers, cost some change but safer then stock but still will pass an inspection.
 
#34 ·
The epa just needs to be disbanded, could you imagine how much taxpayer money would be saved if they wernt there. I will just run a stock exhaust with every thing gutted out.
 
#40 ·
I feel like we can only blame ourselves. Our nation has grown from (mind you most of you's reading this are NOT of this type) hard working men and women, to lazy, obese, government hand out b*tches. Its time to cast your vote and start to change this world back into "The Peoples Nation". Why did the diesel world come out with a MPG killing 6.4? Well most people could just buy a "green" car or carpool to work. Some of us, the "hard workers of america" rely on using a big truck for everyday use. So we simply cannot just stop driving. Oil companies will pay millions to deny exceptional mileage vehicles to be produced. Back in the day my father told me a story of a carb that could boost MPG to well above 30, but the deisgn was bought out and hidden ever since. Now wether that story is true or not I still believe we have the technology to produce a 25+MPG diesel, capable of 800+tq with minimal emissions. Water Meth has proven to be a successful emission reducer along with a substantial power adder. just my .02
 
#41 ·
It's very possible. My dad gave me a Popular Mechanics magazine a few years ago and said "hey, you might like this". It was about a guy who didnt even graduate highschool, and he built a Hummer H1 that ran off of FIVE different fuels. They mentioned that Ford and GM noticed his skill and abilities, but thats as far as it went. The government has their hand way too far into this crap. The EPA needs to be stripped of every dime they have so the creative minds of us Americans can once again, go to work, and make this country great again. God knows the government cant do it.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top