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Towing compounds

10K views 17 replies 8 participants last post by  vader's fury 
#1 · (Edited)
Well I have been debating going with compounds on my F-450 for awhile now and finally decided I am going to do it. This is not going to be a crazy hp setup but I do want something that I can tow heavy with regularly but still strap to the dyno at an event and lay down some decent numbers. I am looking for a solid 450 hp for towing but be able to lay down 500+ on the dyno.

The truck is a 2000 F-450 standard cab chassis truck with a ZF6 manual trans. It has 250/100 inj from Swamps and a full fuel system and RR from Marty's Diesel. I am in the process of ordering a new Valair clutch for it. I will be going with the Dual disc rated for 650 hp as I don't like the idea of running a clutch on the ragged edge all the time.

As for the compound setup.... I plan on using S400 frame turbos for both the primary and secondary chargers. For my primary I am looking at a S480/88 with the 1.32 T6 Exhaust housing. As for the secondary I am looking in the range of a S464-466 with a 1.00 or 1.10 exhaust housing.

I will be running a wastegate around both chargers for tunablility.




Now for the question part. I am in no way an expert on turbo's so I am looking for input from some guys with more experience than me.


1. What do you think about the size exhaust housings I have picked for each charger? (I think the 1.32 might be a lil big)

2. Do you believe I will need to wastegate around the primary? I was thinking I wouldn't need to because I am not running that much fuel but figured better safe than sorry.



I plan to try this out with the 250/100 that I have now and if I need to after everything is done I am willing to step up some with fuel. Swamps is the tuning that I am running now and will continue to be. I have expectations of making the trip down to their shop once everything is done for some custom live tuning to try to get to where I wanna be.

So what do ya'll think? Input is appriciated both positive and negative. :psnb:
 
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#2 ·
That is pretty much what I was looking at also. The 88 and 66 combo and gate the small into the large. I was not goin to gate the big charger at first but I was going to build the flange into the piping so if I needed it I could just bolt it in. I was going to go with the next size smaller housing on the s400 1.15 iirc. But I am going to run 238/80-100% not decided on nozzles. I was going to give the small housing on the 66 a try first.
 
#3 ·
We use our QSSB turbocharger for the high pressure turbo in our twin turbo kits, works really well. The smaller frame turbo helps get the big gate between it and the firewall, plus with it being mounted square with the motor, the intermediate pipe is a little easier to build in there. Good low end response, and with the external gate set properly we can achieve great pressure ratios for a smooth linear power curve. The 'Towing Twin' kit we build has supported 700hp on fuel and Blowby runs it and is running 10's :ford:
 
#4 ·
I looked long and hard at the twin kit offered from *** believe it is a very nice kit but I call myself a DIY guy and am actually looking forward to the challange of building this myself.


I understand the reasoning for using a smaller frame turbo and am entertaining the idea of using a S3 but like the added strength of the S4. I also plan to use Jake's mount kit which mounts the turbo square to the motor for the extra space you referred to.
 
#5 ·
i think your wasting your time honestly. All your goals can be met with a good single. I towed a #### ton with a mod h2e, 3.55 gears and an auto. You'll have much lower gears and more of them with the manual, a 66mm charger will put you above 500 easily by itself and spool very well.
 
#7 ·
I know that I can meet my goals with a single and have good spool up but I believe that a set of twins will exceed my expectatiions and also leave me room to grow later down the road.

I know that the h2e and gqssb are good 500 hp turbo's but that is about their limit from what I understand and I don't wanna build a setup that is on the edge when all out.

Plus I don't hhave to try very hard to picture myself pulling the inj one day down the road and turning them into 300/200 or something similar when the 250 power level gets boring.
 
#9 ·
If your wanting a hot rod and tow rig out of a 450 your crazy. Build the 450 to 300-350 hp and tow the hell out of things then buy a cheap beater and hot rod it. Your going to end up spending more time fixing broken #### on your 450 then you will driving it. Honestly i thought you were crazy for wanting twins for 500ish hp but hot rodding a 450 makes even less sense.
 
#8 ·
What are you gonna do about the 10,000 lbs the 450 weighs to keep it from being boring. :poke:
 
#10 ·
Actually while I have not actually weighed the truck it is more like 7000 lbs which is right where most of our trucks weigh in at. Hell I would be willing to be money that it weighs less than your CC truck.

If your wanting a hot rod and tow rig out of a 450 your crazy. Build the 450 to 300-350 hp and tow the hell out of things then buy a cheap beater and hot rod it. Your going to end up spending more time fixing broken #### on your 450 then you will driving it. Honestly i thought you were crazy for wanting twins for 500ish hp but hot rodding a 450 makes even less sense.
Why would I be spending more time fixing stuff then driving the truck? Everything on this truck is beefier and stronger than what comes on the 250/350 trucks and people are turning them up all the time. The truck is no heavier than a cclb 350 dually. Actually being as it is a standard cab chassis truck with a lightweight flatbed on it i would believe it is a good bit lighter. It has the dana 80 rear already in it instead of the 10.5. It is only 2wd so that removes alot of the extra drivetrain headaches right there.

I just don't understand why making a hot rod tow rig out of a 450 is that crazy. I would rather do that then constantly be running at or over the gvwr of a 350 or a 250 like most do.
 
#11 ·
Well that ain't bad, I was picturing a cc with heavy steak body.
Prob thinking more like the 550 with it's gears, and weight, a tough build to make as peppy as a 600 hp 250.
 
#13 ·
Ya that is one of the reasons I jumped on the truck when I found it last year. Lightest weight chassis configuration you can get and I built the bed for it myself. Plus it had the 6 speed manual which I prefer when towing to an automatic. Just personal preference.


Also I should say, that when I refer to it as a "hot rod" setup I only mean for dyno events and such. I have no intention of this being a "hot" street truck. I just want the power there for towing and be able to lay down some good numbers. I have a street truck in the works for playing around with.
 
#17 ·
Vader, one thing you have to consider if how much more of a cluster fuk will it be under the hood. By that I mean if you have to pull an injector on the side of the road what will you have to unbolt to get at your valve cover? Might not ever need to but it is something I always like to keep in the back of my mind.
 
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